Medway council lied about overpayment recovery

Dean0537

Ok for clarity this is whats happening, the la paid housing benefit to the HO, they then claimed they overpaid so then took the money back from the Ho, we were the left 4 months behind on rent, we paid the 4 months up with the HO only to find that we had to also pay the LA back !!!! Yet they already got the money back from the HO!!!!!!!!!

Marisco

Dean0537 wrote: »

Ok for clarity this is whats happening, the la paid housing benefit to the HO, they then claimed they overpaid so then took the money back from the Ho, we were the left 4 months behind on rent, we paid the 4 months up with the HO only to find that we had to also pay the LA back !!!! Yet they already got the money back from the HO!!!!!!!!!

Well that's a bit different from the original op!! Your rent goes straight to your landlord then? So the council got the overpayment back off your landlord .i.e the HO, you then ended up owing 4 months rent that equated to the overpayment. You paid your landlord the arrears, and now the council want you to pay the overpayment, although they have already had it back off the landlord. Is that right?

Have you asked the council why they want you to pay the overpayment, given that the landlord has already paid it? Is it lack of communications somewhere along the line, because the whole thing doesn't make sense!! I don't think even councils are daft enough to think they can get away with getting paid for the same thing twice!!

bestpud

Dean0537 wrote: »

Ok for clarity this is whats happening, the la paid housing benefit to the HO, they then claimed they overpaid so then took the money back from the Ho, we were the left 4 months behind on rent, we paid the 4 months up with the HO only to find that we had to also pay the LA back !!!! Yet they already got the money back from the HO!!!!!!!!!

Ah ok!

So you've accepted the overpayment and repaid the council.

But the council also reclaimed the same overpayment from the HA?

You need to get records from the HA showing the money has been returned to the council. Then find evidence of your repayments to the council for the same debt.

They don't have a leg to stand on as there should be clear documentation showing all of this.

You are appealing for the wrong reason! You aren't trying to get out of repaying the overpayment as you've accepted and paid it. What you want them to do us recognise they've been paid twice for the same debt and they owe you a refund.

All the talk of not knowing about it and giving reasons they should write off the overpayment is hiding the real issue.

Do I have that right?

atrixblue.-MFR-.

the council has to notify the HA that an overpayment has been made and a breakkdown of this overpayment.

the HA will return that amount back, inturn they should also notify you that an over payment has occured and what steps that are inplace to recover the amount, in this case thier step was to notify them.

it was duely bound by your HA to recognise that an overpayment was issued to your rent account this is why they have rent officers, YOUR HA has failed to recognise that an over payment was issued if they had an upto date notifaction of your situation at that time.

but in either case the HA will have to return the cash back to the council, at that point the council should be satisfied that the arears have been cleared and should not pursue the claimant anyfurther.

this is where the HA should then be contacting you for the arears to wich you have now paid so should be settled.

you now need to contact your HA for the re-issue of payment to the council in statement form sent to you urgently.

contact the council and forward a copy of the letter from the HA, this should stop them chasing you, and backdate any sanctions they have made to the claim and issue a formal apology for their error.

if they continue to chase you ask for the debt wait for court and produce your evidence there the judge will throw it out, and the court cant persue you for the same debt unless they have sufficient evidence to suggest you owe the debt and any arrears accrued ontop of that debt.

Anubis_2

Dean0537 wrote: »

No we do not, we have paid for one independant welfare benefits special list to view thecorrespondane and have also had this verified from two other specialists, there is no way we would have known how much was paid and when as we have no access to the accounts and they are paid direct to the housing association. None of the overpayments were a result of what we did or didnt do, medway council have deceptivly added a 3rd point to the housing benefits regulations and its a point which simply does not exsist.

Every year you receive a letter stating the award for HB and CT with a breakdown. Are these overpayments within less than 12 months or more, or a period before and after the award letter?

loobyloose

I've had an overpayment occur and was forced to pay it as they just took it out of my benefits without the ability to appeal, was no fault of my own, no circumstances had changed, it was medway councils incompetence.
I too have my HB paid directly to landlord and wasn't told anything.
I have never had rent statements as such ever, don't think they ever give anything like that out.

Anubis_2

loobyloose wrote: »

I've had an overpayment occur and was forced to pay it as they just took it out of my benefits without the ability to appeal, was no fault of my own, no circumstances had changed, it was medway councils incompetence.
I too have my HB paid directly to landlord and wasn't told anything.
I have never had rent statements as such ever, don't think they ever give anything like that out.

The statements come from the housing/CT benefits department informing you of your award for that year. You receive them once a year. They don't come from the LL of the social housing. It's an annual review that I believe all recipients are subjected to.

Dean0537

This morning after sending every bit of paper i had regarding this i have received the reply i hoped for from a legal advisor who specialises in this matter. I can confirm that (loopyloo take heed) medway council have infact lied and we were never liable to repay the money. Please see below the letter i have written in response

After careful consideration we have decided to adopt the support of a welfare benefits specialist. We therefore would like you to continue with our complaint. We also have a number of questions and requests regarding the email response you supplied.

I note that you Explain that you had consulted with the relevant Service area, as someone who is not familiar with what the relevant service area would be would you therefor clarify for me the following:

1. Please explain in detail what exactly the relevant service area would be regarding my specific case.

2. Please explain in full what it was that you had to discuss.

3. Please kindly inform me exactly what and who the relevant service area is.


Also for the sake of clarity and to ensure we are both understanding the same regulations and statutes i would be grateful if you could do the following:

1. Please state the full title of the statute you have quoted in your last response.

2. Please tell me the year of the statue that you have quoted.

3. Please kindly confirm that references relate to the statue above. Ie the regulations 2006.

It is imperative that i understand that the correct procedure was carried out specifically in my case, i therefor ask you to kindly confirm the following:

1. Please confirm that the correct procedure has been carried out with reference to our overpayments.

2. Please confirm how you investigated this and how you came to the conclusion that the overpayments were recoverable.

3. Please explain in FULL detail why as a resident who's housing benefit is paid directly to his landlord we have had to repay the HB overpayment and NOT the housing association who received the money.

4. Please give all dates when you made contact with moat housing in regard to recovering overpayments.

5. Please can you confirm or deny if you were aware that the HB overpayment had been sent directly to Moat Housing.

6. Please explain why, if you were aware the overpayment was paid to the landlord why you then made us liable to repay the overpayment.

7, if you did not the overpayments were paid directly to the landlord please explain why your investigation did not yield this.

8. Please inform me off all dates in which letters/ notices were sent containing the minimum statutory requirements.

9. Please send copies of all letters of benefit overpayments so i can cross check them with the notices that i have received.


I am also keen to understand the point you made in your last email with reference to the Housing Benefit regulations. You stated in your email that a benefit overpayment is recoverable if it is :

1. No-ones fault

Please give full details of the following:

1. Please indicate which act or statute indicates the comment above.

2. Please inform me if the decision to refer to "its No-ones fault" was your decision or that of the chief executive or any other representative, employee, agent or third party within medway unitary authority.

3. Please explain in full if this error could or is the fault of the DWP or the HMRC.

4. Please give full detailed explanation how reasonable expectation was investigated and decided within the council.
5. Please give me any or all dates of when any information was supplied by the DWP/HMRC.

6. Please confirm if you consider it true that we had informed you / medway council of the relevent changes.



It is my intention to send this letter by recorded delivery, i will reiterate that i do not feel Mr **** has been helpful nor has Mr **** made every effort as per the medway council customer care charter.

I kindly ask for all information to be supplied.

Mrs_Arcanum

loobyloose wrote: »

I've had an overpayment occur and was forced to pay it as they just took it out of my benefits without the ability to appeal, was no fault of my own, no circumstances had changed, it was medway councils incompetence.
I too have my HB paid directly to landlord and wasn't told anything.
I have never had rent statements as such ever, don't think they ever give anything like that out.

We have to send our HA tenants quarterly rent statements.

Now how legal any arrears or overpayment claims would be without these is another matter.

Morlock

Dean0537 wrote: »

I am also aware from your letter that you have stated that as you informed us of the changes in your circumstances at the appropriate time, you cannot be held responsible for the length of time taken to process the change and as such, you should not be accountable for the overpayments. I also note that you have advised that as payments were going to your landlord, you would not have known that you were being overpaid as you did not have sight of the payments.

Whilst I agree that references to the Housing Benefit Regulations are not accurate, the above quote seems to indicate that your circumstances changed. And it may be reasonable to assume that you expected your housing benefit payments to be reduced because of a change in circumstances.

If the following post;

Dean0537 wrote: »

Ok for clarity this is whats happening, the la paid housing benefit to the HO, they then claimed they overpaid so then took the money back from the Ho, we were the left 4 months behind on rent, we paid the 4 months up with the HO only to find that we had to also pay the LA back !!!! Yet they already got the money back from the HO!!!!!!!!!

is the main issue, you seem to be focussing on the wrong aspect.

You don't appear to have explained any of the above in your correspondence. Your last post appears long winded and confusing, not really making any point at all.