Mortgage company claiming I underpaid

Suzzieqq

I found my self in the lucky position of being able to pay off my mortgage last October 2011.

I contacted C&G who gave me a redemption figure and I duly paid off this amount.

I had received no statements from C&G since I moved into a new house in 2010 - they claimed they had sent out the statement to the Plot number rather than my address - but I didn't receive these.

Today, May 26th 2012, I received a letter from C&G stating that they had made a mistake, had erroneously credited my account with £9,000 and I now owe them this money. This in spite on them previously stating my account had been cleared.

Any advice please?
Many thanks,
Suzzie

McKneff

How did they erroneously credit your account, you need to find out how they did this.

Did you get your redemption figure on paper.

Suzzieqq

I have no idea how they credited my account erroneously. In terms of the redemption figure I have letters from C&G saying the loan was cleared. Suzzie

McKneff

Do everything in writing and find out how it came about.

Come back for more help.

holly_hobby

You could make a statue access request (SAR), this will give you every document that was ever issued with your account, inc oral history ie recorded telephone conversations. Max fee is £10, they have 40 days to statisfy your request.

Alternatively/in addition to - ask for full documentary evidence of their claim and explanation, with evidence, as to why they believe they had incorrectly credited your account with 9k - he who asserts must prove being the way to tackle this.

Should at the end of it all, their claim be accurate and a genuine error, technically/morally you will have to repay it - BUT they should allow a period of time for you to satisfy the request, and I would argue for a reduction on the sum in respect of the distress and inconvenience caused.

NOW, if you simply don't have 9k to repay them, not in work etc, or simply say "your mistake, go away", then pursuance would have to be via the court route - and quite whether they would present this mess in front of a Judge (who may rule that you don't have to pay it back due to their massive mess up, IF it is correct ), I don't know .... !!

You need to take some legal advice on this too, CAB free duty solicitors whom will advise on the legal implications and where you and they lawfully stand (as I say IF they can prove where the mistake happened etc).

At the end of they day, they simply can't expect to send you a letter say "Hi, You owe is 9k", and you say "no problem just tell me how you'd like it, cheque or cash ?" .... you both want and are legally entitled to question their request, and demand supporting documentary evidence to the same ... the very same they would ask of you if you claimed you overpaid them and they hadn't realised ....

Hope this helps

Holly

DVardysShadow

holly_hobby wrote: »

.... At the end of they day, they simply can't expect to send you a letter say "Hi, You owe is 9k", and you say "no problem just tell me how you'd like it, cheque or cash ?" .... you both want and are legally entitled to question their request, and demand supporting documentary evidence to the same ... the very same they would ask of you if you claimed you overpaid them and they hadn't realised ....

Exactly. And further more they cannot expect the money now any faster that they would have had it under the mortgage had you paid all but £9000

Poppy9

How much mortgage did you originally have and did you suspect the redemption figure was too loo.

i.e. say you had a £15 interest only mortgage and they told you that the redemption figure was £6k then if it did go to court I think most people would surmise that you know knew it was incorrect. Not saying you had to inform them of their error but you must have had a rough idea of how much you owed to know you could pay off the mortgage.

bigadaj

Poppy9 wrote: »

How much mortgage did you originally have and did you suspect the redemption figure was too loo.

i.e. say you had a £15 interest only mortgage and they told you that the redemption figure was £6k then if it did go to court I think most people would surmise that you know knew it was incorrect. Not saying you had to inform them of their error but you must have had a rough idea of how much you owed to know you could pay off the mortgage.

As poppy says context is critical, it would be strange for this to be related to the actual mortgage sum so could it be an early redemption penalty that wasn't applied. If you pair nine thousand less than the mortgage amount you would probably have to pay, but over an extended period, if they had forgotten about a penalty or fee then logically they should write this off.

Suzzieqq

Thanks for your responses.
Ther amount I had borrowed was around £190k. Because this constituted and existing mortgage of £160k and a top up for the remainder AND C&G had not sent statements I wasn't exactly sure how much I owed when I paid off the mortgage. I did expect it to be slightly higher than the £187k I paid but not £9k higher and I said this to C&G at the time. Unfortunately this was all done over the phone............... However at the time they confirmed the amount I was paying was correct and that there was no outstanding balance after the payment was made.
Kind regards,
Suzzieqq

getmore4less

What were the full details of the loan,

date you drew the money, amount, interest rate, penalties redemtion charge, closing frees, monthly payment, no of payments and final amount paid and when.

Can do an estimate to see if there is a discrepancy

holly_hobby

All docs inc the redemption statement they sent your conyencer will be on your file - you could directly ask them as I say for such info, if they become awkard about it, you could SAR them.

Alternatively, contact the conveyencer who conduct the conveycing for you at the time of the redemption, and ask for a copy of the same docs on his file.

Essentially, it could be argued, that the onus or responsibility re an error from a lender in calculating an inaccurate final remeption statement, is not and can not be laid at the mortgagors door.

In that is completely reasonable to expect an indvidiual layman, who has been advised by their fianancial provider of a redemption figure, who pays that sum, and who is then advised by the lender of a closing nil balance statement, to accept such information and sums o/s to have been both verified before release and to therefore be accurate.

Don't forget we also have a conveyencer in the mix, whom directly requests and recieves the closing redemption statement from the lender, checks it over, and accordingly raises any discrepencies they see with the mortgagor.

Now, I'm not saying that if the lender has made an genuine error, that they should simply absorb any loss, far from it, but what I sam saying is that somehow turning the onus on the mortgagor (which I feel this is the way its going) in that in essence its somehow their error, as they should have realised it was short at the time of redemption and put they hand up, a little unfair - esp if this was a C&I arrangement and a previous absence of statements (however I agree that the OP not pursing absent annual mge statements to be a little lax and neglectful. Unless they were a FTB when effected, and didn't know annual mge statements are issued by all lenders).

Back to the plot, I would expect on request the lender to provide all supporting evidence to their claim, and a clear audit trail as to the source and cause of their discrepancy.

If their figs are correct, then as I say, the indvidual should be given the opportunity to arrange a scheduled (interest free) repayment plan, if they are unable to make a the payment in one instalment.

If the individual says your mistake live with it, the lender may look to register a default and/or puruse directly through the judicial route, or simply put it down to a bad day at the office, and have it written off the books under bad debt.

Qualified advice from a legal practitioner is necessary, along with the documentation I have advised she request from them.

Hope this helps

Holly