Being chased by ex employer for repayment of study fees

bigadaj

londonTiger wrote: »

actually I remember watching a michelin star chef talk about his own eating habits, he was saying after a long days hard work, he prefers to get a double cheeseburger from maccy dees than go home and cook for himself all over again.

So often people who do something professionally may not be able to transfer that into their own lives.

bear in mind, trainee accountants are grossly underpaid, I dunno why, but the accountancy profession gets a rep as being lucrative and stuff, but I know people whove been doing it for 5 years and only make £30K working for big firms.

Doesn't sound an unreasonable sum for adding up some figures in your mid twenties, despite the bizarre view in the UK that you deserve a fortune for handling money itself, accountancy is neither brain surgery nor rocky science.

londonTiger

bigadaj wrote: »

Doesn't sound an unreasonable sum for adding up some figures in your mid twenties, despite the bizarre view in the UK that you deserve a fortune for handling money itself, accountancy is neither brain surgery nor rocky science.

actually it is a challenging area, especially corporate accounts, It's not just a matter of adding up numbers.. maybe if you're selling conkers in the playground for a living. But complex businesses have even more complex finances. Accountancy is up there with the legal and medical professions as one of the most intellectually challenging jobs.

Plus you are expected to a lot of studying on your own time so that you can do your job. For about 10 years you will be spending 3-4 hours a week of your evenings studying, even more on the run up to exams.

Doesn't sound like a lot, but when you are doing a demanding 9-5 jobs, the last thing you want to do is go home and open up the textbook to do some more studying.

I worked as a trainee accountant for 4 months and then I threw in the towel, the accountants were always busy busy busy. They were underpaid, I guess they're analytical introverts and don't really have people skills to negoitate better pay.

That's something I noticed, the geeks and the nerds are the worker bees of large organisations, but they never get as much credit for their jobs as much as sales people and directors do.

bigadaj

I'm probably a bit older than you but historically accountancy was always a non degree subject, this only really changed in the eighties. At that time partners in the big five, as it was, would all have joined as eighteen year olds with a levels, so it's not really comparable to medicine and unfortunately law is another area that is over hyped here, many clever guys but also very average ones.

My point is that this isn't helping the country, moving figures around, you need financial discipline but innovation and actually producing things are key, and were far behind the yanks in innovation and the Germans and Chinese in making things, but hey let's just move some figures around to make it look better.

londonTiger

It's been around 30 years since the 80s, you clearly don't know what you're talking about. Being a "degree subject" or not is not a realistic measure of how challenging/easy a subject is.

There are micky mouse degrees like business studies and media/film studies that you can go to uni for, they're probably less challenging than a-level maths.

I know people who went to uni to do accounting, and then graduated and got a few exemptions for foundation level for their ACCA/CMA and they've told me how difficult the chartered exams are in comparison to uni exams.

With regards to your second point, it's a bit pedantic. Germans, Chinese, Americans need Accountants too.

Can I ask what you do for a living?

bigadaj wrote: »

I'm probably a bit older than you but historically accountancy was always a non degree subject, this only really changed in the eighties. At that time partners in the big five, as it was, would all have joined as eighteen year olds with a levels, so it's not really comparable to medicine and unfortunately law is another area that is over hyped here, many clever guys but also very average ones.

My point is that this isn't helping the country, moving figures around, you need financial discipline but innovation and actually producing things are key, and were far behind the yanks in innovation and the Germans and Chinese in making things, but hey let's just move some figures around to make it look better.

analyst_2

This paying back fees to employers thingy always gets me.

It seems to me that these employers are quite prepared to take on staff who's training has been provided and paid for by someone else.
But don't let any DARE to leave their employment without paying it all back.

As I see it, as an employer, if you are prepared to take from the pool of trained employees you should also be prepared to give back to it.

Did anyone notice the words give and take in that last sentence?

Sadly, since the 80's, Britain has become ever more a greed driven society.
Hands up all those who know who created this mindset.

opinions4u

Sadly, since the 80's, Britain has become ever more a greed driven society.
Hands up all those who know who created this mindset.

Even though such study clawback agreements existed decades before Margaret Thatcher was Prime Minister.

bankhater_1965

londonTiger wrote: »

actually it is a challenging area, especially corporate accounts, It's not just a matter of adding up numbers.. maybe if you're selling conkers in the playground for a living. But complex businesses have even more complex finances. Accountancy is up there with the legal and medical professions as one of the most intellectually challenging jobs.

Plus you are expected to a lot of studying on your own time so that you can do your job. For about 10 years you will be spending 3-4 hours a week of your evenings studying, even more on the run up to exams.

Doesn't sound like a lot, but when you are doing a demanding 9-5 jobs, the last thing you want to do is go home and open up the textbook to do some more studying.

I worked as a trainee accountant for 4 months and then I threw in the towel, the accountants were always busy busy busy. They were underpaid, I guess they're analytical introverts and don't really have people skills to negoitate better pay.

That's something I noticed, the geeks and the nerds are the worker bees of large organisations, but they never get as much credit for their jobs as much as sales people and directors do.

any tom !!!!!! and harry can do basic accountancy aswell as law , i have been doing it myself for the last 10 years with success , in my opion its a overated profession which is soley down to someone carrying out the law of the land or goverment rulings , nothing self contructive about it , london tiger stop trying to make out its something that it isnt

antrobus

analyst wrote: »

...
Hands up all those who know who created this mindset.

Tony Blair?

bigadaj

londonTiger wrote: »

It's been around 30 years since the 80s, you clearly don't know what you're talking about. Being a "degree subject" or not is not a realistic measure of how challenging/easy a subject is.

There are micky mouse degrees like business studies and media/film studies that you can go to uni for, they're probably less challenging than a-level maths.

I know people who went to uni to do accounting, and then graduated and got a few exemptions for foundation level for their ACCA/CMA and they've told me how difficult the chartered exams are in comparison to uni exams.

With regards to your second point, it's a bit pedantic. Germans, Chinese, Americans need Accountants too.

Can I ask what you do for a living?

Just noticed this has been resurrected so thought I'd respond.

I'm a consultant engineering geologist, not really bigging up what I do as my work is related to mining, construction and environmental works, so certainly not manufacturing.

The uk has been very odd in pushing these ephemeral areas of work, ie those which are purely dependent on the whims of government and legislature. We certainly need accountants and lawyers, but to have lawyers dominating government and accountants dominating business isn't a good thing, variety is the key. We could also go into the short term approach of the uk whereby people can't build a business, but it is sold or split up for short term greed but that's a whole other area.

antrobus

bigadaj wrote: »

... but to have lawyers dominating government...

Only 14% of MPs were formerly lawyers. And in any case, they're not the problem; it's the 21% formerly employed in the Media/Public Affairs and the 24% whose former profession was nothing more than 'Politics' that are the problem.

In my opinion anyway. And massively off-topic I know.