Help with my 3 kw solar panel quote please

shafeeq

Mart.

Thanks again. That is very clear about strings. There is 1 tree at one of my back neighbours house, there is a slight shade early in the morning. Probably in Winter but by then it will loose it's leafs

So It will make sense to go with SMA inverter?

Shafeeq

albyota

Mart, you have really taken to this PV lark, it is clear, you are now, I would say, probably more knowledgeable than a lot of the so called professional companies out there, the company I work for have me to design and specify PV systems and it was a massive learning curve for me (30 years as a sparks) when we started the PV installations 18 months ago, I have to say your help and advice is spot on mate.
Keep it up.

Martyn1981

shafeeq wrote: »

Mart.

Thanks again. That is very clear about strings. There is 1 tree at one of my back neighbours house, there is a slight shade early in the morning. Probably in Winter but by then it will loose it's leafs

So It will make sense to go with SMA inverter?

Shafeeq

Hiya Shaf. SMA are the most popular, so they tend to get mentioned the most. I don't know much about the inverters and their respective reliability. Presumably we'll start to get a little anecdotal evidence over the next 5+ years as we start to see any early failure rates.

I'm unintentionally biased, since I've got 2 SMA inverters, and because the Sunny Design software is free to download, so when I'm simply playing with these numbers, I obviously only have info on SMA inverters to relay.

However, I'm sure all the people with Fronius, Power One etc etc inverters are just as happy. Maybe it's wrong of me to think this way, but I've got a lot of trust in German electrical kit. They do have a good reputation for high levels of engineering practice, a reputation that the UK needs to rebuild (fingers crossed). So don't be too swayed by SMA.

Albyota - thanks for the kind words. I just find all the renewables stuff fascinating. I also have a very odd brain, so whilst I often forget to relay messages, or remember why I just went upstairs, I do tend to remember most of the posts I've read, and roughly where and when they were posted, so I'm able to check back and simply pass the info on.

It's only fair to say, that any info I know or pass on, is only possible due to somebody else kindly posting a response to a question of mine or somebody else's in the past. The circle of life - social media wise!

PS Where's you been? haven't noticed you posting for a while.

Mart.

shafeeq

Hi Mart.

Thanks again the reason I asked is if it will cost me £100 more for SMA Inverter and with it you can have it as 2 strings. Would having 2 strings an advantage.

I suppose if the panels are divide in 2 sets. Then it will be advantage to have 2 strings.

Best Wishes
Shafeeq

Martyn1981

shafeeq wrote: »

Hi Mart.

Thanks again the reason I asked is if it will cost me £100 more for SMA Inverter and with it you can have it as 2 strings. Would having 2 strings an advantage.

I suppose if the panels are divide in 2 sets. Then it will be advantage to have 2 strings.

Best Wishes
Shafeeq

Shaf, for your size system I'd expect all the inverters to offer 2 strings. The voltage from 5 panels or less may be too low for most inverters to allow 2 strings. But for 12 panels (voltages of different makes and models varies, but are close enough for general discussion) a split of 6 + 6 should be OK.

Looking up the Power-One Aurora inverter, and guessing that the company would use a PVi-3.0-OUTD:

http://www.power-one.com/sites/power-one.com/files/pvi-3.0_3.6_4.2-outd_usna1.0.pdf

You'll see 3 interesting facts (OK not interesting, but work with me on this):-

1. it has 2 strings
2. max input on any string is 2000W, so unless I'm misunderstanding this, 2 strings would be required, not just preferrable
3. it also has 2 MPPT's, even better.

Looking up the SMA SB3000TL, there are actually 2 models that look identical and have the same name (how helpful!)

http://www.sma.de/en/products/solar-inverter-without-transformer.html

One model is transformerless and has 1 MPPT (presumably what you are being offered).
The other model has 'Reactive Power Control' (not a clue!) but has 2 MPPT's, which would be better.

MPPT stands for maximum power point tracker, the clever inverter tries to find the highest power point on your system, given that individual panels will vary a bit, and also shading factors.

By having 2 (or sometimes described as dual) MPPT's, then the inverter can independently maximise the output from each string. An added advantage of this (probably not relevant to you) is that with dual MPPT's both sets of panels don't have to be identically aligned. So you could have one string on a SW roof and another on a SE roof. You could also have differing roof pitches, and differing string sizes (eg a SB4000TL with 16 panels, set up as 10 on South roof at 30deg slope and 6 on a SW garage roof at 20deg).

If you can get dual MPPT then great, but don't get too fixated on this if shading all year round is little to none, as the 2 strings will help. However, if it was me, I'd go for dual if the price is right, just to wring every last drop out of the system.

(trust me, this all starts to stick after a while) :eek:

Mart.

Julie-H_3

Have you chosen your system yet as i would be very interested in your choice?
We are currently deciding between a 4kw Sunrise, Phono Solar or Yingli system. The Yingli are slightly cheaper, but the suppliers are offering only a 5 year workmanship warranty, compared to a 10 year warranty for the other 2. The Sunrise panels also have a 12 year warranty where the other 2 have a 10 year warranty.
Is there any value in the extra warranties before we decide?

shafeeq

Morning All

I had an email back from company A yesterday "Unfortunately none of our suppliers will deal in Yingli panels, as they are still regarded as inferior cheap Chinese imports."

I replied back and thanked them for all their help. I must admit they were helpful and friendly, only think is they used to Sunrise panels and they have their reasons. I had another reply back from them.

"I am really sorry we couldn’t quote you, however we were advised not to quote on the Yingli panels due to the fact that we offer a 10 year workmanship warranty and the panels are unproven."

I have decided to use YingLi Panels, but not quite finialised the Inverter yet. Probably it will be Aurora PVI-3.0. The other choice I have is SMA 3000TL. Company C have mention another Inverter which they is good. Fronius IG30.

I have asked Company C to provide me a full quote to make sure everything adds up. I told them if SMA 3000TL is less then so much then do that otherwise stick with Auroa.

The good thing about SMA if understood is that it has bluetooth. So you can download software and monitor it via PC.

The Iverter fill be fixed in a loft and for me it's won't be easy to access, so it will be an advantage.

Thanks
Shafeeq

Martyn1981

Julie-H wrote: »

Have you chosen your system yet as i would be very interested in your choice?
We are currently deciding between a 4kw Sunrise, Phono Solar or Yingli system. The Yingli are slightly cheaper, but the suppliers are offering only a 5 year workmanship warranty, compared to a 10 year warranty for the other 2. The Sunrise panels also have a 12 year warranty where the other 2 have a 10 year warranty.
Is there any value in the extra warranties before we decide?

Hiya Julie, if you've read this thread you'll know that panel choice is a nightmare, so if you can't find anything that particularly scares you about any suggested panel, then don't drive yourself mad.

Panel warranties are tricky, as you'd really need to know if the company will still be around in 10 to 12 years time. However, personally, I'd prefer a longer warranty where possible, better to have it than not to. 10 years seems fair.

You seem to be getting similar YingLi advice as Shafeeq, if you look at these two sites you'll see that different panel series have differing warranties.

http://www.solar4trade.co.uk/media/uploads/YGE_235_Series_EU_EN.pdf

http://www.yinglisolar.com/frontend/downloads/datasheets/Panda_265_Series_EU_EN.pdf

I wouldn't have concerns about the 10 year Panda panels, but I'd choose the 10 or 12 year alternatives over the 5 year panels – if it was me, and I had the choice.

I don't know what panel prices are, but I'd guess that the YL Pandas will be a higher price than the 5yr panels they've quoted.

Mart.

Martyn1981

shafeeq wrote: »

I have asked Company C to provide me a full quote to make sure everything adds up. I told them if SMA 3000TL is less then so much then do that otherwise stick with Auroa.

Thanks
Shafeeq

Morning Shafeeq, just to be difficult, and to prevent you having a relaxing day. Would it be worth asking how much more it would cost for a dual MPPT SB3000TL? Absolutely no idea if it will make much (or any) difference to your annual total generation - but you've gone this far!!!! The company may say you simply wouldn't benefit, I've no idea.

Mart.

Julie-H_3

Thanks Martyn,
I was wondering if the workmanship warranty has any value. As the company that are doing the Yingli panels are only offering a 5 year workmanship warranty, whereas the companies doing the Phono Solar and the Sunrise systems are offering a 10 year warranty. Am i right in believing that REAL insist that all installations and warranties have to be covered by insurance, which the installer has to pay.
Sorry the reason i am asking is because i am erring towards going for the companies that are offering the insurance backed 10 year workmanship warranty, if the cost of the systems are similar as that must have a value.
Julie