yep... its paypal again

toffe

RFW wrote: »

I don't really know what else Paypal can do in cases like this. If it happened the other way around and the seller said the buyer had returned an empty envelope and they hadn't, how do they know who is being truthful at the time. In this case you can see the buyer has offered the same item, but again the buyer may have bought another and been selling that.

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true, its impossible for paypal to determine who is telling the truth in cases like this which is exactly why they should stay out of customer disputes.

on the flip side, for the op, this "debt" isn't a debt at all and is totally un enforceable.

it would be god if you could call paypal again and record them telling you that they are not in the slightest bit interested that the buyer sent you back an empty envelope (even if thats not exactly how they word it) as their refusal to properly investigate would show a gross lack of consideration to you as a customer, meaning that their binding you to their contract terms would be unfair in accordance with the unfair contract terms act (for businesses) look it up....

RFW

toffe wrote: »

true, its impossible for paypal to determine who is telling the truth in cases like this which is exactly why they should stay out of customer disputes.

How is that possible? I could understand that as an argument for Ebay if it was a non Paypal payment but by holding the money they have to intervene when asked.

toffe

RFW wrote: »

How is that possible? I could understand that as an argument for Ebay if it was a non Paypal payment but by holding the money they have to intervene when asked.

they don't have to they choose to. if you opened a merchant account with your bank they would not get involved in disputes so why do paypal?

RFW

toffe wrote: »

they don't have to they choose to. if you opened a merchant account with your bank they would not get involved in disputes so why do paypal?

Credit card companies get involved in disputes all the time. You're really saying that you'd prefer a free for all?

Buyers are comfortable with Paypal because of the security it offers, that's the service they provide, unfortunately where there is money there will always be villainy and someone is always going to be badly done to, I believe Paypal minimise that as much as possible and certainly as far as a buyer is concerned that is as close to zero as it ever will be.

Invalidation

You should first, immediately send a letter to EOS stating the debt is in dispute, you have no contract or agreement with them and that you will only deal with Paypal. You should then contact Paypal and deny any responsibilty. You should give them 14 days to take you to court and, failing that any further demands for money will be reported to the Police as harassment.
Simples.
You could also mention that if they do not cease and desist in their demands you may make further charges against them for aiding and abetting a Fraud.

davmail

Invalidation wrote: »

You should first, immediately send a letter to EOS stating the debt is in dispute, you have no contract or agreement with them and that you will only deal with Paypal. You should then contact Paypal and deny any responsibilty. You should give them 14 days to take you to court and, failing that any further demands for money will be reported to the Police as harassment.
Simples.
You could also mention that if they do not cease and desist in their demands you may make further charges against them for aiding and abetting a Fraud.

Nice one......

ebay...myarse

Many thanks for all the replys everybody.

just to make things a little clearer. My business that i set up is a Ltd company and has no link with paypal or this issue. I mentioned it as i was trying to expalin that due to the business that i recive a fair few "signed for" items a week.

I have also recived another letter from the cretins today, claiming payment within 7 days or further action will be taken.?

if i was to do as advised by "Invalidation" letter to EOS then contact PP will that resolve the issue do you think?

i just want closuer on this now as its getting annoying.

demystified

PayPal will sell the debt to a debt collection agency if you don't pay and then they will chase you for the debt by sending endless pay-up-or-else letters and possible phone calls, but no-one has been taken to court yet (to my knowledge)

Taadaa

I am probably being really naive here but...

He submitted a tracking number for an empty envelope (never heard of that one before :eek:) and that can be linked to the empty envelope you received. An envelope with the tracking number on the front presumably? That the original car part could not possibly fit in? With no evidence that the sticker has been removed, or the envelope was taped to a box? I think I would have taken it a bit further with Paypal. Fair enough it might have come to nothing but worth a shot.

Invalidation

You need to contact EOS IMMEDIATELY informing them that the debt is in dispute and they have no legal rights on you or your posessions. Then contact Paypal and ask for the reasoning and legal liability that they think they are basing their claim upon.Tell them you are happy to go to court and let the courts see the evidence and for them to decide.
Neither Paypal nor Ebay like the courts as when they lose it will open the floodgates of litigation against them.
Ive issued County Court proceedings against both Ebay and Paypal, they will send threatograms by the score and will then even get a solicitor to call you. They will finally back out at the last minute and settle.