Help! Bought a stolen car

davidmaiden18183

Tuns out I bought a cloned car on Thursday for £3400 via a private sale that it is assumed is therefore stolen.

I'm totally gutted. The reg passed a £5 hpi check and wasn't listed as stolen- the reg plate used anyway was fake and the police inform me that registration does correspond to an identical spec and colour car at the other end of the country.

My brother and I have both been dubbed, all the vechical identification numbers at several points on the car were all correct and matched the v5 (which we now know was fake, as is the tax)

The original vehicle identification numbers on the car have all been filled/grinded off and painted over


We have been to police and reported it and and they have looked at the car and the documentation and confirmed it is a clone. Obviously it is assumed it stolen as it too cheap to sell at a big profit and doesn't appear to be an insurance write off that should be scrapped but slyly repaired and returned to the road.

I know I can't get my money back (well nog unless the slim chance the guy gets found and caught)- I don't know his address, and his name is probably fake and his mobile number not not in use so unlikely.

I also understand if they can link this vehicle with the owners it was stolen from it will be returned to them and I will be out of pocket.
!Similarly if the owners insurance company have already paid out to the owners they will take ownership and sell on at auction, or to me at a cost to recoup their losses (usually the value of what they've paid out!)

What I was wondering though is if the original vehicle identification numbers have all been removed/filled/ground off how can they identify whose stolen vehicle this is? What happens if they can't identify whose vehicle it is? Do I get to keep it yet on a new plate (I.e. a Q plate?)!

Basically anyone knows what will happen if they can't identify it?

Thanks

Dave

paddedjohn

why not go back to the vendor and demand some answers?

davidmaiden18183

His mobile. It just going straight to answering machine. It was probably a temporary number created for the scam only.

I don't know where he lives, the sale was when he met me half way. I didn't live too close to where the cae was but work apparently took him up this way so we could meet.

Also don't think the name he gave me is real!

sassy_one

David, a few things.

One, Google this chaps telephone number, see if you can find any ads or such online.

Where was the car advertised? If online like Gumtree, contact them with all the details you have as they do record all IP addresses for ads posted.

If the google search proves fruitless your next plan would be to Google his given name, as someone else may have had this same problem, and you'll make a connection.

Has the car been seized at present by the Police under PACE as evidence?
I'm sure they will attempt to obtain its engine number as well as other hidden serial numbers that are hidden on most newer cars where criminals don't know.

Another thing, how many keys did the car come with? One should make you wary.

Finally, the HPI check you did I expect for £5 didn't come with insurance in case it was stolen or cloned, however it's worth checking in case you have a claim.

sassy_one

Also, if you were given or saw the V5 Logbook I suspect it was one of the thousands that were stolen from DVLA, so I'd contact DVLA so they can pass such details on to the officers dealing with the theft of those V5's
Does your V5 start with any of these?

BG8229501 to BG9999030 and BI2305501 to BI2800000

sassy_one

One final note before I go, it is likely if the car hasn't been seized yet that the Police wont start the initial investigation, they will pass it on to VOSA who will examine your car and also send someone up wherever the other car is to examine that one.

When VOSA do this they will examine both cars and be able to tell which on is which, for sure.

IF, and it's a big if that they can't tell which one has been cloned its POSSIBLE, that both your car and the other owners car could be seized until they get to the bottom of it.

If yours is found to be the cloned (Ringer) car then there's a few things open the Police, VOSA and the insurer (if it has been claimed against)
They could let you keep the car, at the cost of the insurance claim, they could also return it to its owner, either way you must be prepared from herein losing what you've already paid, it's gone.

I know it's to late, but for future, if something sounds too good to be true it probably is.
In future if you OR ANYONE reading this considers buying a used car, ring DVLA Swansea when your AWAY from the seller and give them V5 serial number from the logbook, they will able able to tell you if it's a fake, false, stolen, tampered with or otherwise genuine V5 document.


Sorry to hear of your circumstances and hope you get it sorted!

verityboo

sassy-one wrote: »

Finally, the HPI check you did I expect for £5 didn't come with insurance in case it was stolen or cloned, however it's worth checking in case you have a claim.

Insurance with HPI type checks which covers stolen vehicles is only valid if you quote the vehicles actual chasss number.

The OP says the V5 is fake with cloned number plates. It is likely that the chassis numbers have also been changed/disguised so even with an expensive HPI check, the insurance would not be valid

In effect, the OP just ran a check on the real car at the other end of the country

davidmaiden18183

verityboo wrote: »

Insurance with HPI type checks which covers stolen vehicles is only valid if you quote the vehicles actual chasss number.

The OP says the V5 is fake with cloned number plates. It is likely that the chassis numbers have also been changed/disguised so even with an expensive HPI check, the insurance would not be valid

In effect, the OP just ran a check on the real car at the other end of the country

This is correct, my check was effectively one that checked the vechicle that had been cloned. It's cost £4.99 I think and doesn't come with any insurance

harveybobbles

So you didn't notice the VIN numbers had been ground off before you parted with the money..?!

TonyMMM

Ground out VIN numbers can almost always be recovered using an acid process - filled and painted ones are even easier to read.

davidmaiden18183

sassy-one wrote: »

David, a few things.

One, Google this chaps telephone number, see if you can find any ads or such online.

Where was the car advertised? If online like Gumtree, contact them with all the details you have as they do record all IP addresses for ads posted.

If the google search proves fruitless your next plan would be to Google his given name, as someone else may have had this same problem, and you'll make a connection.

Has the car been seized at present by the Police under PACE as evidence?
I'm sure they will attempt to obtain its engine number as well as other hidden serial numbers that are hidden on most newer cars where criminals don't know.

Another thing, how many keys did the car come with? One should make you wary.

Finally, the HPI check you did I expect for £5 didn't come with insurance in case it was stolen or cloned, however it's worth checking in case you have a claim.

Thanks for your help sassy one

I've already have been continually searching the phone number to see if any other adverts come up or have been on the past. Only the one I purchased comes up so far and that just leads to an autotrader holding page as the advert is expired/removed.

As you've now gathered it is autotrader. I can contact them but for data protection reasons I doubt they would give me IP's etc, but perhaps monitor further activity from it. The police would have better access to this info. Obviously there should be a payment card and address on file for the advert

In all likelihood all signs point that this was a professional job by more than one person as part of a setup. And it's highly likely mobile numbers used were temporary, and the card info and names/addresses used for it also stolen.

The car came with one key, the other not seeming to work-excuse that it must just need a new battery.


Believe it or not I follow the mantra of it seems to good to be true it often is. There is a fine line between knowing what's a good deal a good price and a bargain and what is untoward. Anything that wasn't right that we saw or would make me suspicious seemed to have a valid explanation or plausible, and I am very suspicious.

Still...my brother and I were both had