Dilemma for house in Lochalsh

mark_of_rothwell

I have recently bought a 3 bed bungalow for refurb in an acre of land containing dozens of very mature evergreens up near Kyle.
First thoughts were 'free fuel for life!' get log burner/boiler/buffer tank and I checked out EcoAngus etc.
I plan to retire there in maybe 5-10 years and until then get some income from holiday letting, so thought that any potential holidaymakers wouldn't want to bother with the rigmarole of having to be tied to feeding a boiler.
First jobs are double glazing and fitting the radiators and pipework, but I'm torn as to how to heat the place until I move there myself full-time and go for the 'full-blown' log system.
There's no gas...would like to go for Ground or Air source but I think a bit costly for only a few years so I suppose it has to be oil or LPG?
Or maybe a log burning stove in the living room would only need to be supplemented by a couple of electric rads in the bedrooms?
I'd be grateful for any thoughts...ta

Ms_Chocaholic

what about electric storage heaters?

mark_of_rothwell

Never given them a thought....always thought of electricity as an expensive fuel for heating. Are they better than those plug in rads? Do you warm them up at night on Economy 7 or something?

welda

A guy I worked with for a few year, moved up to Balmacara, house already had electric heating system, plus a woodburner in his lounge.

With him being a highly qualified HVCA engineer, he knows his systems, domestic and commercial. For various well thought out reasons, he decided to leave as is, and remains same to this day.

But with you having an acre of land to play with, I reckon it would be a good idea to cost ground source heat pump. Especially if refurb entails concrete floor on ground level, ideal for ground source!

Think outside the box, what will fuel costs be in five year time, higher in ten years time.

Then you have to think about when you retire, will you have the energy to coppice wood to feed a burner with boiler attached that will require a fair amount of wood?

That said though, wood burners are great, even better is all the fuel is free. You need to do the math, then decide.

Cheers.............

Ps, Scottish Hydro is main ball player up there, check out their tariffs.

mark_of_rothwell

Thanks Welda,
I did make enquiries about both ground and air source....I'm having one of the neighbours come to excavate for a septic tank soon so would get that side of the job done reasonabley, though the house itself is built on bedrock I'm told, but the heating bloke told me air source would be more suitable to the wetter West coast climate

welda

There have been a few horror stories regarding air source, not that the technology is poor, other factors with sizing a system, how well the building is insulated ect.

I don't have the knowledge to compare one against the other, but I am curious to know why rainfall makes a difference?

Hang in around here, there are a few good members who know their stuff with these systems, I'd give their replies more credence than mine

Enjoy your visits to gods wee part of our world and, remember, Screwfix is your firend up there, delivery to door, or over an hour drive to B&Q at Inverness :j

Cheers.

mark_of_rothwell

Thanks again, my heart and my holidays have always been in the far north-west...and I didn't know that about Screwfix....

lovesgshp

GSHP units are good for wet ground situations. Your heating engineer obviously has no real experience or knowledge of the optimum operating conditions.
Have a read of the link below:
http://www.gshp.org.uk/frequently_asked_questions_Domestic.html

From that, this may answer your heating engineer:
I have some very wet land. Can I use this?

Yes, wet land is better at conducting heat so, as long as a trench can be dug, it is ideal.

TiredGeek

Welcome to the wild side I've got a place in Sutherland with the aim of retiring there as well

ASHP would work if you can't get a decent trench in for GSHP, and while the investment up front is higher, you're looking for retirement so the lower running costs in the future will be to your advantage Also, technically, these systems are "fit and forget" once it's working right.
If you decide to go for either of these systems then the fitting is key. Get the company wrong and you are screwed. Ask me how I know

While we're on the subject of fitting. You are planning to do the radiators and plumbing yourself? I'd advise deciding what heat source you are going to use before making any decisions. For HP systems you'll want much bigger radiators than if you had oil, and the water pipes would want to be bigger as well. Under floor heating is ideal if you have that option (I don't).

Screwfix is really good, but don't count on the next day delivery bit as the last part is covered by local couriers. My Screwfix "48 hour" orders sometimes turn up a week later..... it's a sod if you're waiting for something. You'll soon learn to plan well ahead.
They do have a two week return policy though. If you live somewhere that has a local branch then buy all the gear you want two days before you go, and buy spares as well. Then use what you need and take back the other stuff in the two weeks for a full refund. When you're halfway through a job and find you needed an extra elbow, you'll be really glad you have some spares in stock. Inverness is a long way away....

In the short term, multifuel wood burners in the main rooms, storage heaters in the bedrooms, and a supply of peat / logs sourced from a native. That'll keep your letters happy as most of them find the idea of a real fire romantic

PaulF81

If you are going to refurb and live there for ages, celotex/kingspan the walls. It may be worth doing external, but for ease of DIY, we used internal and its made a massive difference to fuel consumption. We also double insulated the roof space using Npower loft insulation deals and again, this has made a big, big difference.

Our woodburner does save us a fortune in winter and we are still burning wood that the arb chopped down 2 years ago (leyland cypress, and yes, its well seasoned and we havent had any creosote problems).

If you are somewhere windy, look into draught exculsion and some form of built in dehumidification system to reduce steamed up windows, we run an expensive mitsubishi dehumid and a lot of our damp problems went overnight.

Shop round, companies we use regularly - Screwfix, travis perkins just-insulation (google it),mcveighparker (fencing) ebay (for tools, if you are planning lots of DIY I reccommend getting decent second hand (makiata, dewalt are good brands), you will NEED - electric drill, SDS Drill, sliding mitre cutter, jigsaw, orbital sander, circular saw 3 ft Level (with laser if you are posh) plasterboard carrier. things which are nice - Router and router table, electric planer.

With these tools, I have insulated the walls, installed T+G flooring, plasterboarded walls, chased out for wiring, installed plumbing, installed a kitchen, fitted solid oak flooring, reframed the doors, installed Oak window boards and doors throught the house...Oh, I am a pilot by trade so no way the most practical when I started. eI self-tought myself wiring and got it signed off by building control and saved over 2 grand.

One thing I have done also is hire trade for the jobs I CANT do (IE plastering), and saved a fortune. there are so many guides online, many jobs I was originally fearful of turned out to be really easy. Push fit plumbing is foolproof (so is soldering if shown how to properly to be honest). Plenty of online calculators for required pipe dimensions vs length of run, all we did was pay for someone to do the bends I couldnt do (pipe bending like plastering is a definite art rather than diy skill!) and of course the gas work. Oil may mean its practical to do yourself and get signed off by BC as its easier to spot a leak!

I would seriously look at oil rather than leccy to suppliment the burner though, as showers/baths get expensive off the immersion.

Hope this all helps and if you need any advice PM me!

Oh, get a decent 18" sthil 250 for the pine. dont bother with a hand saw and get a roughneck mattock and log splitter. Best 40 quid I have spent in ages! Ebay is your friend!

Oh, www.diy-not.com is your friend!

muckybutt

Having had ASHP I certainly wouldnt recommend it for an old poorly insulated property, our house is brick built 1850's cottage in Yorks. ASHP was seen as the way to go with a grant from the council, we had it installed for about 2 years and it cost us a b***dy fortune !, thing is it works great and cheaply when its nice and warm outside as the heating circuits only have to tick over, when its cold they work their nuts n bolts off and thats where it cost us a fortune. If doing again I would go for GSHP where the temp below ground is constant.

However if its to be a let then we have stayed in many a cottage in the Highlands and its always been down the route of elec storage rads, one in each bedroom and one in the living room, they are better now than they used to be years ago.
You could also look at the new electric radiators or an electric boiler with the addition of wet rad system.

Then when you move in you could look at adding a gasification wood boiler to the wet system if you go down that route and having a dual fuel system electric during the summer months when you dont want a roaring fire and wood for winter months.