IT entry level work - Why are IT recruiters so impossible?

epm-84

Companies have generally cut IT department budgets. If they only have 2 employees now they don't want a junior who is learning the business, if they had larger teams then a junior would fit in to do the more remedial tasks.

TrickyWicky

cherrub wrote: »

To be honest, even reading your posts would put me off recruiting you. You come across as an over confident script kiddie who has played with PCs, done a bit of HTML, and poked about a noddy SQL database. This is the last sort of person I want anywhere near a production system.

Sheesh, you really are judgemental aren't you. I came here and asked for advice and explained my situation and experience. I didn't ask for a slagging off. To be honest, I wouldn't want to work for you - you sound like my last boss - arrogant.

Where did I say I've done any html? - I said php / mysql but never said html. Sure I can write it but I never mentioned it as I prefer the back end stuff - you've just jumped to a conclusion in order to launch an attack on me. Do you even realise how old this topic is?

cherrub wrote: »

Nor do I need you to tell me everything that is wrong with said system.

Well if you ever find bits of your system not working and can't figure out don't bother listening to people who can see the problem then. Some companies are grateful for a fresh pair of eyes, you're clearly one of those bosses who isn't open to anything but their own ego.

cherrub wrote: »

Believe it or not, I will know what's wrong with it, I also know why it's like that and the reasons it hasn't been fixed (never criticise someone else's system until you fully understand the history behind it).

Ah, there it is, the EGO comes out to prove itself! IF you know whats wrong with a system and you're not fixing it then I question your advice in this thread at all.

If there is a problem with a system at work and I get asked a question then I will answer it. Simple. Likewise if a recent update has introduced a bug that never used to be there, I think its pretty reasonable to tell the bloke who wrote the code so that he can fix it. The last I heard, thats how the workplace is supposed to work - everyone pulling together to keep things running. The main coder wasmore than happy with this and openly admitted he often missed things.

cherrub wrote: »

Hopefully, the above isn't true at all, but if that is how you are coming across to recruiters it will explain why you are having no luck.

Pot, Kettle.. You're the one who's just launched a scathing attack on me slagging me off for helping out a former employer etc.

I'd put my luck down to (as many people have said) my lack of qualifications. Without that I don't even get an interview.

The rest of your post I'm not responding to. It's pointless, I'm busy working on a multithreaded server at the moment. Guess which one has priority - You or it.

TrickyWicky

paddyrg wrote: »

If you really want support roles, try and get some formal networking/whatever qualifications. Do you know all 7 layers of your TCP/IP stack? Do you know why this is important to know? Do you know your DNS from your DHCP? If an open network had a cookie-based token authentication which authenticates on the first time the browser is fired up, why would it always fail for an https link as the first link?

For a systems support role, it is incredibly useful to know and be able to discuss this kind of thing at interview. Systems support people will never write a line of compilable code (maybe an odd batch file!).

However if you're going for a development role, SHOUT about your Win32 library development!

Thanks for your input. At the last interview I had I did end up discussing some of the projects I'd worked on and how I used them along with creating my own tools to test / diagnose things etc. They really liked it but took over 30 of us through to the next step. I found out I was up against people with degrees etc so I never stood a chance

My brother works in IT and doesn't write a line of code and never has yet he works for one of the very large property websites in their DC openly admitting the most he does is rebooting the odd server

rexreo7

The MNC look at the full [FONT=&quot]personality of the person who are going for interview.
The body language of the person should be good otherewise he/she will get fail in there interview, communication skill in english is must in an MNC. Lot of othere things matter when you are going for an interview in MNC.

Rex
[/FONT]

DKLS

TrickyWicky wrote: »

Sheesh, you really are judgemental aren't you. I came here and asked for advice and explained my situation and experience. I didn't ask for a slagging off. To be honest, I wouldn't want to work for you - you sound like my last boss - arrogant.

Where did I say I've done any html? - I said php / mysql but never said html. Sure I can write it but I never mentioned it as I prefer the back end stuff - you've just jumped to a conclusion in order to launch an attack on me. Do you even realise how old this topic is?



Well if you ever find bits of your system not working and can't figure out don't bother listening to people who can see the problem then. Some companies are grateful for a fresh pair of eyes, you're clearly one of those bosses who isn't open to anything but their own ego.



Ah, there it is, the EGO comes out to prove itself! IF you know whats wrong with a system and you're not fixing it then I question your advice in this thread at all.

If there is a problem with a system at work and I get asked a question then I will answer it. Simple. Likewise if a recent update has introduced a bug that never used to be there, I think its pretty reasonable to tell the bloke who wrote the code so that he can fix it. The last I heard, thats how the workplace is supposed to work - everyone pulling together to keep things running. The main coder wasmore than happy with this and openly admitted he often missed things.



Pot, Kettle.. You're the one who's just launched a scathing attack on me slagging me off for helping out a former employer etc.

I'd put my luck down to (as many people have said) my lack of qualifications. Without that I don't even get an interview.

The rest of your post I'm not responding to. It's pointless, I'm busy working on a multithreaded server at the moment. Guess which one has priority - You or it.

That was no attack, it was a fair assessment with some great advice thrown in for good measure.

Perhaps you should reassess your attitude, unfortunately companies can afford to be very picky these days and you need to stand out for the right reasons and not the wrong ones which you have clearly displayed on this thread and others.

Maybe just learn from people who have experience and do the hiring for the roles you are interested in.

TrickyWicky

DKLS wrote: »

That was no attack, it was a fair assessment with some great advice thrown in for good measure.

Yes there was. I was told that I was an over confident script kiddie who he'd not want near a production system. Bit strong don't you think considering I was only asking how to get a FOOT in the door as a 1st line support role. I never asked how to get in as a full time programmer did I? - I simply tried to demonstrate that I have some half decent knowledge and got a kick in the teeth for it.

Which would you want in your 1st line support role?:
1) Someone technically minded who can often see how things work
2) Someone who doesn't have a clue and will be a hinderance

DKLS wrote: »

Perhaps you should reassess your attitude

I did and I came here asking for help. Unfortunately asking for help seems to be an open invitation for insults and teeth kicking around here from those who have 'made it' and want to try and rub other peoples noses in it. Saying harsh things and throwing insults isn't going to help me in any way is it.

DKLS wrote: »

unfortunately companies can afford to be very picky these days and you need to stand out for the right reasons

And this is what I was asking for help with. You're just another person who has wanted to wade in, throw in an insult or two and not actually provide any real useful help as to how I can improve myself.

Nowhere have you or cherrub suggested a decent exam board that is recognised or anything else have you? No. Instead you've just thrown insults and then reinforced them.

You think I don't feel crap enough about myself for not making the grade?

As for dragging other posts into it, thats just low. So I used to work in car parking.. so what? Everyone has to survive somehow and everyone deserves an opportunity to try and make something of themselves and ask for help. Everyone except me apparently. I have nothing - No friends, no family, no money and no prospects. I came here to ask for CONSTRUCTIVE HELP and look whats happening.

marybelle01

Good grief you really do have a chip on your shoulder, don't you. Who the hell mentioned car parking, and who the hell gives a damn that you used to work in a car park? Apparently nobody but you.

TrickyWicky

marybelle,

This thread has been dragged up after weeks of it being forgotten and buried and suddenly its being flooded with negative posts towards me.

How would you feel?

[Deleted User]

Want to get a job in IT, but everyone else has a degree? Get a degree then.

You probably also need your CV tweeking to bits and then tweeking per job applied for

My old boss didn't have a degree, but he had a tonne of 'the right experience' and he was making > £60k

marybelle01

TrickyWicky wrote: »

marybelle,

This thread has been dragged up after weeks of it being forgotten and buried and suddenly its being flooded with negative posts towards me.

How would you feel?

Well I don't see anyone dragging anything up except you. I can't see what you are are referring to. What thread? Where has it been dragged up and by whom? I can't see a single reference to car parking here except the one made by you!

Frankly, you may not like the advice you have got here, but it sounds spot on to me. You're competing against highly qualified candidates for even entry level positions - a couple of GCSEs and a Microsoft certificate aren't going to cut any ice. If you are serious - and if you are that good - you need a degree. And you need to cut back on the attitude if you come across in applications/ interview anything like you have here!

I work in a local authority and our IT people are some of the worst paid in the industry. Nobody who is any good stays because the salaries aren't even a start at competitive. Which is probably why our IT falls over twice a week and none of them ever seem to know why. But every one of them is a graduate. There is no more get in at floor level and work your way up. That's now the route for graduates, who are ten a penny.

So you either give up or you knuckle down and get that degree. No it isn't a short term fix. But it's the most realistic one if this is what you really want to do. And the way I'd feel would be that I'd be grateful for real honest advice whether I liked it or not from people who actually do know what they are talking about; and I'd also do whatever it took,for however long it took, to do what I so desperately wanted to do. And on the latter point I speak from experience. My main career is working in development/ disaster relief. It took me a lot of hard knocks to get in. It's totally insecure - imagine a career that involves waiting on something horrible to happen somewhere, so you can get back to what you do best! No pension unless you buy your own. Sick leave - who has time to be sick? And in between contracts, frankly, pandering to privileged people who don't know how well off they are to live in the UK,but think their "poverty" is an excuse for ignorance, intolerance and abusing their kids. Nevertheless, if I could wind back the years I wouldn't do a thing different. It may be a very different field of work, but the principles are the same. If you want it you have to put your all into it. There are no easy wins and no quick fixes. And if your won't do that, you really don't want it that bad. Which isn't a judgement. It's a fact.