Nuisance neighbour and useless council

abi-em-mum83

Hi please bear with me, I dont know where else to post this and its likely to be quite long winded!
I live in Scotland, but my mum and 16 year old brother (who has learning disabilities) live in Liverpool, in the house they have lived in for 17 years, with no trouble. Last October a new neighbour moved in next door, a young pregnant girl and her husband. All was fine at first, when her baby was born my mum gave her a card and they were friendly. In the week between christmas and new year my mum, uncle and auntie were playing a board game and drinking tea at 9pm at night when the girl from next door (who for ease I will call "Elle" although its not her real name) came banging and screaming at my mums door. When my mum answered Elle attacked her, and her husband had to restrain her and physically drag her up the path to her house. The police were called, but mum decided not to press charges, as she took pity on Elle and chalked it up to her having a new baby. That evening on his way home my uncle was arrested and charged for assaulting Elle, despite being no where near her. He was bailed on condition he stayed away from my mums road (which caused no end of hassle as he helps care for my mum and brother). Since then the judge instantly threw the case out of court as there was insufficent evidence. Since then there has been a string of complaints about my mum and her noise to the local authority, centreing on music and my mum singing. Elle has on several occasions tried to provoke my sister, my mum and others with abusive language and threats, as well as having a family member of hers knock on my mums door to try and get mum to stop any action at the council as this girl is apparently suffering from postnatal depression (despite already trying for a new baby!). My brother was threatened and received a heap of vile abuse from Elles mother, and I myself was hurled all kinds of abuse and names in front of my young children when visiting in February.
Last week my sister arrived at my mums house before mum was home to find Elle in her garden, and she began screaming vile abuse and threats, saying she was going to stab my sister etc, all in front of my 4 year old niece. My mums partner who was indoors called the police, who, from inside commented that they could hear Elle. During this my mum arrived home, who I will admit had been drinking, driven in her car by my uncle (who is insured, and was sober). Elle spat in my mums face, screamed homophobic abuse at my uncle before they got in the door. The police arrived and instantly were not interested in the assault or abuse, but who had been driving mums car (uncle had been shaken up and had drank a can of lager before the police arrived, something they witnessed him doing as he was still drinking it when they arrived!). My mum was very irate and upset, and on this occasion a bit mouthy, I do admit The police warned her to stay out of the living room while they question my uncle over who was driving the car, but my mum was arguing that they had been called because of the incident with next door. The police arrested her (she was never threatening or violent). She was realeased the next morning without any cautions or charges. My sister was advised that pressing charges would get her no where as there was no proof and it could be seen as tit for tat as mum had been arrested.
However the biggest concern is the local authority dealing of the whole matter. My mum has reported any incidents to them as soon as they have happened, but at the moment they seem to be taking Elles side. During Elles attack last week she was screaming to my mum that she was getting her evicted, and knew when my mum was due to meet with the anti-social team officer (she could name the day and a rough time!) Surely this is an error on council officers part. When mum met with him last week the officer told her they had recorded my mum singing and playing music (2 of the 3 songs they say they have recorded she does now own and has never owned), but he was unable to give her times and dates they have allegedly got this recorded. When my mum asked if they had received complaints of the tv that my brother has a habit of having very loud, usually of an evening, she was told that the level of the noise, or the time of the noise was not an issue, more the type of noise. My mum does not play her music late, shes very rarely even up past 10pm (she has her own health problems), and she certainly doesnt have it blaring. In fact when we were down visiting in Feb, we held a small birthday party for my daughter. I had music on for musical chairs to which mum kept telling me to turn it down its much too loud. And as for the singing, my mum used to be a professional performer, she sings when shes in the shower, when shes hoovering, the same as most people do! My mum was offered an abatement order and asked for a copy to take away to allow a solicitor to look over it. The copy she was given had someone elses details on!
Mum attended a further meeting today with the council officer and his manager. Again she felt their mind had been made up and she was being treated unfairly. When she quizzed them on dates of the recordings she was told they were between x and x dates, a time span of almost 2 weeks, (despite the first day of said time span being impossible as she had stayed over night at my sisters and the house was empty!). She was told Elle had been provoked my a status on facebook by one of her daughters (so either my sister or I), of which they have a print out, talking about Elle, which Elles daughter saw. Apparently Elles ex partner and one of her childs father died, and said daughter did not know the circumstances surrounding it, until she saw this post. Now I had no idea this guy was even dead, and nothing was mentioned that he was died, anywhere on my Facebook, nor my sisters (mine is completely private so how she could of seen anything on there I do not know!). They kept bringing up my mums arrest, and when my mum asked why she still doesnt have a cctv camera or noise monitor, as she has been asking for one for months, she was told she was on the waiting list (although next door seems to have one very quickly). In the end my mum said she was unhappy to carry on with the meeting until they had some actual evidence to show her, and she had some legal advice. I had screen shot threatening posts from Elles husband on Facebook towards me, as well as others where he and Elle laugh about my mum being a "crank", but unfortunately my phone was faulty and these didnt save to my memory before my phone died completely!!
She has met with a solicitor who said at the moment there isnt much they can do, and since my mum does not receive benefits (she receives my fathers war pension as she is a widow) she would not receive legal aid. My mum has been recently prescribed anti-depressents and anti-anxiety medication as she is a wreck. She is scared to even talk on the phone to me. Next door is constantly exceptionally quiet, as if they are constantly listening, and now my mum has been told she is being recorded, she is scared of making the slightest noise, and scared that they can hear her private conversations!
Any advice? Do we have the right to demand they provide her with any evidence they have, including transcripts or copies of the alleged recordings they have of her (or at lease exact dates and times rather than a time span of almost 2 weeks), as well as the alleged screen shot of this Facebook conversation. Is she able to get a copy of her partners phone call to the police where it will be clearly heard Elle is screaming abuse and threats? And are the council allowed to use her arrest and subsequent release without any charge or caution in this case (even though technically it had nothing to do with the case with the next door neighbour, she was arrested for breach of peace in her own home, nothing to do with Elle)? Innocent before proven guilty so it cannot be used in this case?
I understand my mum did not do herself any favours by drinking and getting hauled off by the police, but considering the intense stress she is under its understandable. This next door neighbour is manipulative, scheming and clever, and is systematically targetting my mum, trying to provoke reactions from her, something we know she has done to a previous neighbour! My mum has already attempted suicide due to this stress, and believing she has no official support from the council, today they actually said its all against her, and thats a quote! Any advice please!!

theartfullodger

Please summarise clearly.

Sigh!

abi-em-mum83

OK to summarise clearly, my mum is receiving no support from her local authority, Im concerned her human rights and privacy are being breached, and I would like some advice on what she can do to stop this matter escalating.

Wail

You're asking for us to comment on something that will depend on what the council does next.

(2 of the 3 songs they say they have recorded she does now own and has never owned)

Is that first now, a not?

abi-em-mum83

Sorry its a not! They have said she has been recorded as singing Elvis and Mull of Kintyre, 2 songs she does not own.
I apologise my post is very long and probably doesnt make much sense, I have been in tears while writing it as Im so worried for my mums health.
I think first and foremost I need to know if the council are allowed to record her withour her knowledge. She was aware there could be noise monitors, but these would be the sort that record decibel levels, not actually audio. And does she have the right to gain access to any recordings they have of her, or at least is she within her rights to demand they give her exact dates and times they have recorded her committing the alleged anti-social offences.
It is my belief and assumption (something that could be very wrong) that if they were recording all audio coming from my mums home, she would have to be notified. I have a suspicion the neighbour has recorded muffled noises from my mums house, which the council officer has listened to, and they have tried to guess what she is playing/singing (and obviously got them wrong!). This would explain why they are unable to either let my mum hear the recordings, or to give her the exact times and dates of the alleged offences!x

princeofpounds

Abi-em-mum, please space your paragraphs properly. One of the reasons you are not getting any advice is that your posts are very hard to read as a result.

The whole situation sounds like a bit of a he-said she-said situation. Your mother didn't do herself any favours by acting out against the system. Although it is painful, if you are going to use the proper channels to get this sorted, you need to get officials on-side, you need to avoid being over-emotional and frantic. It's all about building evidence up.

If I am going to be honest, your mother does not sound particularly rational. Paranoia about the listening devices for one; if the council are recording they will not be using super-sensitive equipment that can pick up a normal conversation through brick walls, and yes, what matters is the decibel level. If the neighbours can record conversations they can hear it anyway, so what does the recording device matter?

What sort of tenancies/ownership situation are both houses in?

What action did the council say they were going to take next, if anything?

I would advise the following:

- firstly take a deep breath and try to get her to relax. It is a stressful situation but it is not violent, and it is important that she does not allow it to interfere with her daily life any more than it has to.

- organise CCTV cameras and recording devices. Pay for them youselves if you have to. There are particular ways you have to set up a CCTV system to ensure it covers the right areas, but a quick google will find them

- Start to build a proper dossier of evidence. Record all problems. No more 'screenshots but my battery ran out' stories.

- Don't post anything related to the situation on facebook (I know you say you didn't, but don't even given the impression you might have done, and how on earth you are linked to these people on facebook given everything I don't know - remove them).

- By writing letters, in a calm, polite and BRIEF way, try to get more information on the noise allegations. This might be covered by making an data protection request. But you want to ask for written information on what the investigation is all about and for copies of recordings if you can. The council will have procedures, you need to find out what they are and comply with them.

You might also wish to visit the NFH (neighbours from hell forum) for more advice.

princeofpounds

The following would imply that if a noise abatement notice has been served then an invetigation has been taken place and noise has been found. Your mother will need to confirm that the abatement notice she was given applies to her or not. In writing.

Given that the notice she was given had someone else's detail on it, I suspect that this was either a mistake, or that it was shown as an example of a notice. Clarifying this is very important.

http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/HomeAndCommunity/WhereYouLive/NoiseNuisanceAndLitter/DG_10029682

abi-em-mum83

As I say I apologise for the set up of the post, it was written in a rush, when I was upset and very tired!

When I say she is paranoid, I mean she is whispering on the phone to me as shes worried that this recording equipment will hear private phone calls, and other intimate and private moments. Not paranoid in a mental health sense, not in a "they are all out to get me" way.

As for the Facebook I have no links to these people on Facebook, I am completely private, which is why I am completely puzzled as to how they could have "proof" of a conversation, there is no way this person could have access to anything on my page, not least her daughter! And I do not post silly status like this, Im not a child, my Facebook is for keeping in touch with friends and family around the world, not inciting trouble. There is nothing on my FB which can be related to her.

This and the fact they cannot provide exact times and dates their equipment recording my mum allegedly acting in an anti-social manner, lead me to believe that the council are accusing her without any real evidence, only using the word of next door. I would like to know if she is entitled to see any so called evidence they have against her. They have not presented her with any evidence, and I feel she is being dealt with fairly, and is being accused of offences without any actual evidence to back it up.

Not sure if it makes any difference but this neighbours husband works for the council aswell, in a department close to to the anti-social behaviour, and housing team. Surely if her husband is a work colleague of theirs it is a conflict of interests?

As for my mums run in with the police, I agree she has done herself absoloutely no favours, and believe me when I got the call telling me all I wanted to do was shake her. She reacted to a situation that was handled very badly by the police, while inebriated. Had she been sober she would never of reacted as such, but in the same turn if the police would actually take the complaint from her and my sister (who was sober) of the assault and threatening behaviour of the next door neighbour, rather then only being interested in whether my uncle had been drink driving, I doubt she would of been riled up as such.

But I dont believe the council should be saying to her well your arrest basically proves all the allegations against you. How can an arrest without charge or even caution "prove" anything. This neighbour has a father in prison for being a drugs baron, and the neighbour,mum and family, all have previous CONVICTIONS for violence (GBH, assault, harrassment etc). Innocent until proven guilty surely means the council cannot use this against her, or to favour their decisions in anyway?

Wail

An open throw to everyone else but would a Data Protection Request be of the order to show how much the council actually has about the mother

Your Paranoia is not helping the situation either.

Beckyy

Do they own the houses/rent privately/housing association/council houses?

princeofpounds

OK, thanks for the extra details.

Please answer the questions about household status.

If you believe that this family are using their council connections to persecute your mother, what do you think might be their grievance?

This 'Elle' might be unbalanced, but that would not automatically translate into her husband using work channels. So is there something your mother has done (possibly quite within her rights) which has specifically upset them?

I am not trying to brush off the idea that there is some link between the neighbour and the council. It might explain some 'non-standard' procedures in the noise investigation (incorrect serving of a noise abatement order, incorrect procedure of investigation, neglect of your mother's own complaints). But it's a serious matter and one that needs approaching very carefully.