Forcing a Water Meter on me

strokebow1

Hi,

I have a letter from the water board trying to force me to have a meter fitted. I don't want a meter fitted. Even if there were to be money savings (which I doubt), I still wouldn't want one as I would not want to be worrying about flushing the toilet, etc. My wife already suffers quite a lot from stress and so I definitely do not want a meter.

They want to fit one because they say that there has been major alterations at the property. I want to know, are there any rules or regulations which specify what constitutes 'major alterations'? If so can you please show me so I can have a foot to stand on when I attempt to write back to them.

thanks!!

BargainGalore

It looks like they can judging by this old article especially if there is a drought

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/4759960.stm

http://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/bills/article-1637683/Families-to-be-forced-to-fit-water-meters.html

"Water companies are to be given new powers to force meters on millions of families. The installation costs will add billions of pounds to water bills over the next decade - equivalent to £200 per household. "

Gothicfairy

There is no hard and fast rules about sub alts but it is classed as anything that changes the RV of the property..so adding a granny flat, changing it to 2 flats or back into one house etc
STW work on a change of 50% the original form but each company will have their own rules around sub alts.
A swimming pool or large pond can also force a meter.

Truth is every water company ( there is no water board) can force a meter under law and there is little you can do about it really.

Not sure what stress has to do with a meter though as there is a thousand litres to a cubic metre so you get quite a lot of water for your money and sooner or later everyone should end up on a meter anyway.

Sorry if the above is not what you want to hear but it might be better just biting the bullet and working out how to save water rather then adding the stress of fighting something that is perfectly legal.

pinkteapot

In case there's nothing that can be done about their decision...

How many of you live in the property and what size is it? Unless you have more people than bedrooms, it's very likely that your bills will be less.

We (hubby and I) used to live in a 2-bed flat with no meter and paid £40 a month.

We now live in a 4-bed house and use substantially more water and pay £21 a month on a meter. We don't worry about flushing the loo (or having a bath which uses a whole tank of water). Water costs far, far less than gas/elec so they're the utilities to worry about!

macman

Since you can revert back to RV billing within the first 12m if you voluntarily have a meter fitted, that might have been the better route to take. You couldn't lose.
Major building works are certainly a lot more stressful than having a water meter fitted.

Gothicfairy

macman wrote: »

Since you can revert back to RV billing within the first 12m if you voluntarily have a meter fitted, that might have been the better route to take. You couldn't lose.
Major building works are certainly a lot more stressful than having a water meter fitted.

you can revert if you apply for one but not if there is a sub alt on the property and clearly they already know about major changes so the application will be different anyway and the inspector will check the details at the appointment anyway so little chance of getting away with it that way....but I like your thinking

strokebow1

Thanks everyone for responses.

Its united utilities. The building is listed and hasn't been altered in 200 years. However, it has previously been flats. Does that constitute as a sufficient alterations? I have tried searching there website but they give no details of what constitutes sufficient alterations?
Ofwat mention 'structural' alterations on there website. And there certainly has been no structural alterations. Furthermore, they say if your property has changed in size or in use from domestic to commercial purposes or vice versa - it may mean that the rateable value is no longer valid. Again, it has only ever been a domestic property.
In terms of having a water meter forced on you they say this is only the case, if and only if:
- move into a property
- use an automatic watering device (such as a garden sprinkler)
- have a swimming pool
- have a large bath
- have a water softening unit that uses reverse osmosis
- have a power shower
- live in a water stressed area where the Government has allowed compulsory metering as part of a plan to maintain secure water supplies

None of those apply except 'move into a property' but that is not very specific at all.

So, it all depends on the water company, united utilities in this case. Surely they must have some regulations which clarify this.

Gothicfairy

Flats into a house is a major sub alt and the RV will no longer be valid so there is no choice but to have a meter.

That is a different set of rules then forcing a water meter ( ie what you found above)
Whenever the RV is invalid the water company have no other legal option as they can NOT bill on that any more as it does not exist, that I am afraid is a fact and part of the sub alt process and not fitting a meter for free ( FROPT )

mogchops

strokebow1 wrote: »

Thanks everyone for responses.

Its united utilities. The building is listed and hasn't been altered in 200 years. However, it has previously been flats. Does that constitute as a sufficient alterations? I have tried searching there website but they give no details of what constitutes sufficient alterations?
Ofwat mention 'structural' alterations on there website. And there certainly has been no structural alterations. Furthermore, they say if your property has changed in size or in use from domestic to commercial purposes or vice versa - it may mean that the rateable value is no longer valid. Again, it has only ever been a domestic property.
In terms of having a water meter forced on you they say this is only the case, if and only if:
- move into a property
- use an automatic watering device (such as a garden sprinkler)
- have a swimming pool
- have a large bath
- have a water softening unit that uses reverse osmosis
- have a power shower
- live in a water stressed area where the Government has allowed compulsory metering as part of a plan to maintain secure water supplies

None of those apply except 'move into a property' but that is not very specific at all.

So, it all depends on the water company, united utilities in this case. Surely they must have some regulations which clarify this.

Ref the highlighted part above...

So if it was previously flats, was each flat charged individually on RV?
I am assuming that you have now converted it back from flats into a single dwelling, so what are you paying currently? The RV for one of the previous flats, or the combined RV of all of them?

Same as GothicFairy, this constitutes a conversion, therefore the previous RVs are no longer valid, as they were applied when the property was individual flats, and it is now one house.

deanos

did they build flats 200 years ago ??

Fred_Bear_2

strokebow1 wrote: »

Hi,
I don't want a meter fitted. Even if there were to be money savings (which I doubt), I still wouldn't want one as I would not want to be worrying about flushing the toilet, etc. My wife already suffers quite a lot from stress and so I definitely do not want a meter.
thanks!!

I have never thought of that before. Perhaps that is why my wife seems stressed all the time when she is at home.