Civil enforcement ltd.

lorraine851

HI everyone, hope someone out there can help me...

I have been trying to seek advice regarding two letters i have received so far in relation to parking. My situation seems to be a bit different from others that i know and would like advice.

Back in September last yr i went to park in Harry Ramsons car park like i usually do along with many others. On this particular morning, when i arrived there were lots of signs up telling us they were now charging for parking and to call a certain number. One of my colleagues arrived at the same time and together we tried to call. She got through immediately and paid via her card for parking until she could move at lunch time. I on the other hand couldn't get through but got an answer machine. I left a message giving them my car registration as prompted and the automated service said they would call me back.

I had no change on me to move the car to a parking spot on the street with paying meters, so left the car, and walked to my work , when i hadnt heard back from the company was worried and desided to get change and go and move my car which i did. Later that day, when i came out a meeting, i had a missed call from the company asking me to call them back, which i didnt as i had moved my car earlier that morning.

I later received a letter or fine from "cival enforcement Ltd" in Liverpool. They are telling me once a judgment is obtained the option left to them are:

A warrant of Execution
Appoint court balliffs to attnd my property
seize your vehicle/goods
apply for an attachment of earnings order
apply for a third pary debt order.

all a bit worrying to say the least. I did ignore the first letter as i have read somewhere else but didnt expect this.

I would really appreciate some advice as im getting worried.
Regards lorraine

Coupon-mad

Your case is no different really, the detail doesn't matter.

On this forum we clearly say that ANY private parking fake PCN, given for ANY reason, whether you 'broke their pathetic made up rules' or not - IS ALWAYS, ALWAYS JUST A SCAM.

The whole thing is just a protection racket and these companies get away with it because their 'ticket' impersonates authority and preys on people's natural shock about 'parking tickets' and many people's naivety when they receive the first 'debt collector' letters.

Also they get away with it because they hoodwink retailers, landowners etc. into letting them on site on the pretence of 'parking management' which gives them an air of apparent legitimacy. People think 'oh, this can't be a scam because they have some signs up and they've been contracted to ''work'' here by Harry Ramsdens/Tesco/Aldi/McDonalds...' Nope, still a scam, it's just that the retailers/landlords don't realise it until they get complaints.

Your letter sounds familiar so you should be expecting these by now. Pretty sure it's in the letter-chain in the top thread:

http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/forumdisplay.php?f=163

Have a look and see what comes next - I think they even resort to FAKE COURT PAPERS near the end of the scam. This is NO BIGGIE. Just ignore them but complain to Harry Ramsdens and/or whoever your business was with that day. They need to know what their customers/visitors/employees are being subjected to so wait for the worst threatograms and send photocopies of them to whoever you fancy complaining to! But do NOT word such a complaint as an appeal or with any detail about who was driving or whatever.

Word it as a COMPLAINT that they allow this protection racket on site and then that their agents are issuing fake Court threats; remind them that harassment is illegal and implicates the retailer/landowner as well as their agent the PPC. But do wait for the worst scamograms first.

ManxRed

Do not worry.

A few things you need to know. A private individual or company (including Civil Enforcement Ltd, who are well known) cannot fine anyone - they do not have the power.

Instead they base their claims on civil contract law. They basically allege that you have breached the terms and conditions of a contract with them, and are pursuing you for damages. The thing is, under civil contract law, the only redress one party has towards the other in respect of a breach is their actual losses only. Therefore all you legally owe them are the actual parking charges that they failed to collect from you in the first place.

I assume they are now asking for considerably more than this? Well, anything over and above what the parking fees were for the time you spent there would be deemed in court to be a contractual penalty - these are unenforceable under civil contract law.

You also need to know that they cannot simply 'obtain a judgement'. Lordy, if it was only that easy! To get a judgement they would need to take you to court and win. The odds of this are very very small, for starters you'd win, and they know this, so they are unlikely to try. Hence the other bit about the warrant of execution etc, is all tosh.

Their best bet in trying to extort money from you is to simply try and scare you into paying, and that's why they've sent you that letter. Legally, they don't have a snowball's chance in Hell.

Continue to ignore. These companies prey on members of the public not knowing or understanding the legal position regarding such threats. You now know better.

give_them_FA

Lorraine, these peoples' gameplan is simple: There is no legal way they can make you pay. So they resort to bluff and threats hoping to scare you into thinking they are going to take you to court, when actually, they can't and they won't.

Why do you think they resort to lurid threats? It's because they are their best shot. Ignore that and they have nothing and they give up if they can't scare you into paying. They are scammers.

I believe the firm that has written to you routinely breaks the law. They do this because they think they can get away with it.

If they send you what appears to be a County court claim form, but unstamped, take it straight to your local Trading Standards and complain that it is harassment and is contrary to Section 40 of the Administration of Justice Act 1970. You will also have the right to sue them for cash money if you want.... they are crooks.

lorraine851

Thank you very much. I would have replied further but thisis my fourth attempt and trying to find the thread as i think it is called and was getting more worried about this. So pleased when reading the three replies. Thanks again. Lorraine

Coupon-mad

Easy = when you log in, click on your own username and 'find posts by xxxx' or 'find threads by xxxx'.

You can do the same by clicking on other people's usernames. No need to mark or subscribe to a thread you have posted on, I don't.

Stephen_Leak

lorraine851 wrote: »

<snip> I later received a letter or fine from "cival enforcement Ltd" in Liverpool. They are telling me once a judgment is obtained the option left to them are:

A warrant of Execution
Appoint court balliffs to attnd my property
seize your vehicle/goods
apply for an attachment of earnings order
apply for a third pary debt order.

<snip>

I can see a problem with this. Obtaining the judgement.

They can't take you to court, for the same reason that a blackmailer couldn't sue their victim for non-payment.

And all the unpleasantness mentioned would be arranged by the court, and then only if you lost and then you still refused to pay up.

Eventually, they will run out things to threaten you with, and stop throwing good money after bad.

give_them_FA

You sound a bit happier now, Lorraine. Just take no notice of these clowns from now on.

CIVIL ENFORCEMENT Ltd.? I think they could be done under the Trade Descriptions Act as they never "ENFORCE" anything. Just write "UNCIVIL" letters.

Half_way

give_them_FA wrote: »

You sound a bit happier now, Lorraine. Just take no notice of these clowns from now on.

CIVIL ENFORCEMENT Ltd.? I think they could be done under the Trade Descriptions Act as they never "ENFORCE" anything. Just write "UNCIVIL" letters.

but the name does have a certain sound to it, CIVIL ENFORCEMENT just by typing it in caps makes it sound sort of official.

Stephen_Leak

"Uncivil Unenforcement" might be more accurate, but I have to admit that it doesn't have quite the same "ring" to it.

F_The_Gov

I still don't understand why the Government don't do anything about this, or even take some sort of bloody action!

F THE GOV!