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Agency seemingly refusing to give out landlords address
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Your long essay is largely irrelevant. They are taking the view that the boiler was turned up to 3 bar.The water pressure was on 3 bar instead of the usual 1.5 bar water pressure
If you did that then you should pay the bill or have it deducted. The landlord is responsible for repairs but IS entitled to recover costs, even terminate a tenancy, where a tenant commits an act of waste ( which this is)
If you did not do so, then you simply deny it, and make it clear that you will dispute it with the service that protects the deposit.
You would have to explain that when using the manual to fault find, why you overlooked the pressure settings?
Alternatively you might argue that nowhere does it say "not to change the pressure"
The cost of prosecuting the agent for failing to provide the address is more than the £30.
Bluntly there is no way of making this go away you will have to argue it out and I suspect may have to have it independently resolved.Stop! Think. Read the small print. Trust nothing and assume that it is your responsibility. That way it rarely goes wrong.
Actively hunting down the person who invented the imaginary tenure, "share freehold"; if you can show me one I will produce my daughter's unicorn0 -
AFAIAA we have had *one* post on here with a T saying that their Council refused to support them on the issue.
However, some LAs *do* respond once they are in receipt of a formal letter from the T, quoting the relevant law, and with the words cc- x town council TRO/local Councillor/local MP at the bottom.
Yes, imo it's still worth following that route and reporting the agent to the council if they do not comply. If anything it may put them on the council's radar...0 -
Depending on a T's specific circumstances it can also be worth a TRO taking a look at the Protection From Eviction Act 1977:
s7 Service of Notices(1)If for the purpose of any proceedings (whether civil or criminal) brought or intended to be brought under this Act, any person serves upon—
(a)any agent of the landlord named as such in the rent book or other similar document, ora notice in writing requiring the agent or other person to disclose to him the full name and place of abode or place of business of the landlord, that agent or other person shall forthwith comply with the notice.
(b)the person who receives the rent of the dwelling,
(2)If any such agent or other person as is referred to in subsection (1) above fails or refuses forthwith to comply with a notice served on him under that subsection, he shall be liable on summary conviction to a fine not exceeding [F17level 4 on the standard scale], unless he shows to the satisfaction of the court that he did not know, and could not with reasonable diligence have ascertained, such of the facts required by the notice to be disclosed as were not disclosed by him.0 -
Although tbs624 is right about the LL& T Act 1985,s1, there are problems enforcing this. This has come up before and I don't know the answer.
Yes, the law says the agent has 21 days to provide the LL's address, when asked in writing for it by a tenant. Yes, there is a criminal penalty.
But the police are not going to enforce this. And Councils also appear reluctant (esp now with their ever-reducing budgets/resources), unless there is a serious history of other wrong-doing involved.
Whether a tenant can bring a private prosecution I don't know. And whether it's worth it, I doubt.
I had the exact same problem. LAs refused to provide the information, insisting that LL wanted to know why I wanted his address. I pointed out that tenants aren't obliged to give a reason and sent several emails following up my original letter (sent recorded post), but they repeatedly refused to give me the details.
I tried to escalate a complaint but nobody was interested. It's disgusting that a law exists but nobody can be bothered to enforce it.
I now live in my own home and I hope to God I never have to rent again. The law in this country is an a55. Private tenants have no rights whatsoever and are at the mercy of corrupt LLs and incompetent LAs, whilst council tenants and squatters have too many rights and are impossible to evict (I know this from bitter experience with a nightmare neighbour).AFAIAA we have had *one* post on here with a T saying that their Council refused to support them on the issue.
However, some LAs *do* respond once they are in receipt of a formal letter from the T, quoting the relevant law, and with the words cc- x town council TRO/local Councillor/local MP at the bottom.
Many of us have said that the problem is not that we need more laws and regulations - we need the existing ones to be properly enforced.
Completely agree.bunnydrumming wrote: »To be honest I don't think I would want a tenant to have my address if I had an agent (not that I'm a LL)
You'd best never decide to rent out a property out then.;)bunnydrumming wrote: »I have never been a landlord, only a tenant but I always thought that the LL paid the agent to do the hard work for them and so check the contract as to who is responsible - the agent or the LL as some agents are responsible for this - not the LL i believe.
Then you're wrong. Employing an LA does not relieve a LL of all of his/her responsibilities. Unfortunately too many people now think being a LL is an easy way to make money requiring no time or effort from them whatsoever.0 -
Soniclord, Did they give you a manual for the boiler? If so and you followed those steps that the user should do then I can't see what you would have done wrong? If there was no manual then you should not be expected to know how to use it.and that the landlord had been in the house the day before we moved in and he'd apparently set it to the correct pressure (but they didn't witness him do it...)
Why would the landlord need to set it to the correct pressure as opposed to just checking it was already right? I thought boiler pressure isn't something that needs setting that often (if at all between yearly gas checks) unless there is a fault so it seems odd it needed setting just before you moved in. Sounds like a possible intermittent fault with the boiler. Perhaps the landlord didn't turn the tap off properly so the pressure continued climbing.
You should have been given a gas safety certificate I'd be asking for that.0 -
Re. enforcement of s.1 LTA 85, s.34 appears to state that it's the Local Authority and not the Police who have the power to prosecute.0
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You can pay for the information via the Land Registry website.
I did this and it lists the landlords address as the house I'm renting..If I were you I'd be looking to move out after the 6 months as Belvoir clearly don't want you in the property and don't know what they're doing when it comes to lettings.
I don't think it's that they don't want us in the property, I think it's more a case of they are seriously incompetent and clearly shirk there responsibilities when it comes to them being responsible for the repairs.MissMoneypenny wrote: »Have you contacted your council's Tenancy Relations Officer about this and put it in writing? If the council worker is still refusing to do their job, then contact your MP
http://www.theyworkforyou.com/
Yes I have contacted my council Tenancy Relations Officer about this (I mentioned that in my 1st post) and I also wrote what they said to me.
Next step is to contact my MP.MissMoneypenny wrote: »Are Belvoir a member of ARLA? The agency or landlord, really should have checked that the boiler was working before your moved in. If they don't do basic things like this, what else have they forgotten to do! Did the property have and EPC? And an in date Gas Safety Certificate?
They're a member of NALS apparently. Yes the property has an EPC and an in date Gas Safety Certificate but it's dated 27th of January 2012, which in itself isn't a problem but there are stickers on the boiler saying the actual landlord (whose name is on the stickers on the boiler) installed something called Sentinel protector on the 13th of January 2011 but if a gas safety check was done shouldn't the system be drained and refreshed annually with the Sentinel Inhibitor?
It also seems strange that the boiler checked out 'ok' yet the landlord felt the need on the 8th of February to adjust the pressure...MissMoneypenny wrote: »I hope the landlord has obtained consent to let the property?
Not sure about this?MissMoneypenny wrote: »Just edited to ask if you have taken out legal cover with your contents insurance? It's usually an optional extra and costs about £20 extra per year. If you haven't, you might want to get it, but make sure it doesn't exclude legal action against or defending from, a landlord. IMO, DAS offered good policies when I last read their T&Cs, so perhaps read their policy and then ask which insurance companies use their Legal Cover?
Yes I do have legal cover with my contents insurance but I'll have to check if it included legal action against or defending against my landlord if it ever came to that.
EDIT: Just checked and it says on page 10 of the cover booklet,
WHAT IS COVERED,
1) The cost of you taking legal proceedings against another person or organisation as a reult of:
a. a person or organisation interfering with your legal rights relating to your home (you must be legally entitled to live in the home)
b. a dispute over a contract in your name to buy or sell your home or former ohme or to rent your home as a tenant;
or
c. an event which causes loss of or damage to your home
2. The cost of defending legal action brought against you as a result of;
a. you allegedly interfering with another person's legal rights in connection with you owning or living in your home (you must be legally entitled to live in the home).
b. a dispute over a contract in your name to buy or sell your home or former home or to rent your home as a tenant.
That's a direct copy from the more than legal services cover booklet
It also says on the opposite side about what's not covered and it says,
'Any dispute about letting, subletting or allowing another person to live in your home.'
But as far as I'm aware this isn't a dispute about letting is it?
I'm with morethan for insurance by the way if that even matters.MissMoneypenny wrote: »They won't cover for problems before you took out the policy, but as your landlord sounds like he has financial problems, it might be £20 well spent for you.
The policy was taken out before we moved into this property and was taken out in November 2011.AFK_Matrix wrote: »And to double check you are in England yes? You also need to start writing to people and stop emailing them or just phoning them. As it sounds like your going to need all the back up paperwork you can get as I bet your going to have fun getting your deposit back etc. Good luck
Yes I'm in England. Just to clarify though isn't email if printed out a back up of 'paperwork' ?? As it's proof it's been sent to them, just ignored by them.
I bet I'm going to have fun getting my deposit back as well but they've got no grounds to keep any of it nor will they have.bunnydrumming wrote: »Who booked the plumber - as a tenant I always let the LL or agent book any work needed so it was clear who was paying.
I rang Belvoir and they rang the plumber, the plumber then rang me to arrange a time to call round. Either way the tenancy agreement says it's the landlord/agent responsible for the payment as the installations for heating, water etc are their responsibility!
But I get what your saying that if I'd rang a plumber out of the phone book for example then I would have to pay it as I would have chosen to do so, in this case though I did not.bunnydrumming wrote: »I also always took photos of the house as soon as i moved in - easy with a digital camera! photos of any stains on floors, furniture and walls, tears in wallpaper or carpets, knocks to furniture or surrounds of doors. Made sure there was a date on the photos and stored them so when I left there could be no blame attached to me for issues already there.
Oh they had that covered from day one! They (Belvoir) took well over 500 photographs YES over 500...... And put them all onto DVD of which I have a copy.bunnydrumming wrote: »AT same time whenever I move out of a property I clean, clean, clean including renting a carpet cleaner as that is much cheaper then a LL trying to pinch some of my deposit.
Good luck
I made it clear to them on the inventory where it said "You agree for us to deduct money from the deposit for cleaning of carpets etc" that we did NOT agree to that and any 'professional' cleaning would be paid for by us in the form of either renting as carpet cleaner or paying someone to clean the carpets for us before we leave.19lottie82 wrote: »It doesn't matter if the landlord "doesn't want" the T having their address, they must legaly provide it.
Of course repairs are the landlords responsibility. He / She must provide the LA with permission and funds to carry them out. The LA cannot go ahead with repairs without these, they just acts as a " go between".
Exactly they must provide it, I agree entirely, as I agree they are responsible for the repairs also.I would not pay the plumber's bill. Let the dimwit LA/LL try to seek reimbursement from your tenancy deposit when you leave and you can then formally challenge them.
I certainly will as I know I can't lose on this.They called the plumber out and the LL can set the costs down on his tax return.
Exactly.Are they suggesting that you personally caused the boiler problem?
Yes they are, they said either it was me, my partner or someone who helped us move in.
Which is a complete load of bullocks.. Because they (the agency) said there staff member who did the inventory didn't touch the boiler (they believed them!!) and they also believed the landlord set the boiler correctly! Even though they didn't know for sure...chiefgoobster wrote: »The letting agency sound like a right bunch of kn*bs.
Understatement of the year....chiefgoobster wrote: »Your landlord is quibbling about a £30 plumbers bill to deal with his boiler in his house.He's quite willing to let his property out but seems less than interested in looking after it.Another kn*b.
Exactly.chiefgoobster wrote: »You should have,by law, a copy of the Gas Check Certificate.On that it would have the landlords address at the top somewhere.
The only address on there is the agents address.the purpose of obtaining the LL's address is so that the T can write direct to the LL
Which is what I want to do as before we moved in the agent said they would speak to the landlord to fix the door but they didn't! They said to the landlord it would cost £45 to fix the door and that they had promised us they'd fix it, but they didn't bloody fix it! I also don't believe the landlord knows how he's getting ripped of as we had the door fixed and it actually cost less than half what the agency quoted the landlord, it cost us just over £18.There is of course absolutely no excuse for an LA ( or a LL) to deal with a T in verbally abusive fashion.
Exactly, which is why I'm so mad and willing to take this as far as I have to.The OP says that he asked the LA to send a plumbler and that the LA organised it. LA/LL could initially have come out themselves to ascertain whether or not a plumber was needed.
Precisely, but the agent never came out to ascertain anything before 'they' contacted the plumber.propertyman wrote: »Your long essay is largely irrelevant. They are taking the view that the boiler was turned up to 3 bar.
Irrelevant in your opinion? But it does state all the facts about the problem from beginning to end, therefore in my opinion it's all relevant is it not?propertyman wrote: »If you did that then you should pay the bill or have it deducted. The landlord is responsible for repairs but IS entitled to recover costs, even terminate a tenancy, where a tenant commits an act of waste ( which this is)
As I've said we did NOT do that, why would we touch the boiler other than to turn the heating on or off? We wouldn't mess with settings we know nothing about.
So this isn't an 'act of waste' as we didn't do anything..propertyman wrote: »If you did not do so, then you simply deny it, and make it clear that you will dispute it with the service that protects the deposit.
We have made it clear that we didn't do it, we weren't believed therefore it will no doubt be disputed by the agent when the tenancy is over.propertyman wrote: »You would have to explain that when using the manual to fault find, why you overlooked the pressure settings?
We don't need to explain why we didn't fault find as we did look in the manual and nowhere was the fault code that came up on the boiler, we also didn't overlook any pressure settings as like I say we did NOT nor would we touch or change anything if we didn't know how they worked.[/QUOTE]Soniclord, Did they give you a manual for the boiler? If so and you followed those steps that the user should do then I can't see what you would have done wrong? If there was no manual then you should not be expected to know how to use it.
Yes there is a manual for the boiler and a troubleshooting guide as well, we followed steps we could have done with no resolve, so we had no choice but to phone the agent for them to organise a plumber to be sent out.
Lately (within the last 2 days) the boiler has kept giving an apparent 'standard' fault of A3 which gets resolved by pressing the reset button, it happened once yesterday and once today! In my opinion it should never happen but has done. We were in our last house for over a year and the boiler was over 10 years old yet never once failed or stopped working!!
This boiler in this house by the way is a pretty sheet one by all accounts, judging by reviews on the internet and are prone to all manner of faults, the boiler is a Ferroli He 31 C.Why would the landlord need to set it to the correct pressure as opposed to just checking it was already right? I thought boiler pressure isn't something that needs setting that often (if at all between yearly gas checks) unless there is a fault so it seems odd it needed setting just before you moved in.
Exactly what I thought, why did the landlord need to set it, especially if everything checked out 'ok' when the gas safety check was done.Sounds like a possible intermittent fault with the boiler. Perhaps the landlord didn't turn the tap off properly so the pressure continued climbing.
There is an intermittent fault that's been raising it's ugly head the last couple of days but it's mentioned in the troubleshooting guide that pressing reset should fix it, which it has both times.You should have been given a gas safety certificate I'd be asking for that.
We have got that, I asked for it before we moved, well made sure there was one available to give us when we moved in.0 -
I've responded to almost everyone who replied to me, so if anyone else has anything further to add please do
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Sorry for the lengthy replies to everyone but if anyone does have anything further to add then please do read my responses to peoples posts.
Thank you.0 -
TO be honest I have heard stories about bad tenant, bad landlord and bad agencies.
I dont know who is at fault here as believe me all have been known to do random things, but you can try taking up any concerns with head office, contact details are here,
http://www.belvoirlettings.com/contact
I would however advise keeping any future contact short, to the point and fact based.Debt free since July 2013! Woo hoo! The bank actually laughed when I said I have come in to cancel my overdraft.0
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