The right to Cancel - Selling in the Home

arcon5

ukultra wrote: »

Yes I wondered about that, once a window blind as gone into manufacture it costs me a percentage of what I'm charging (I don't yet make them myself). So I'd be happy getting that back plus maybe any expenses, however, I'd guess I was allowed to claim the purchase price charged to the customer.

It's more about sticking to the law than me getting any money back. I know from experience it can cost a load up front to claim money of a debtor and in some cases just isn't worth it.

This is more about trying to do things right. Personally I hate long drawn out terms and conditions on order forms. Most customers look at them (me included) and start to wonder why they need to be there. "Paranoid" LOL.

Someone owed me £11,400 a few years ago, this was a business however, they had set up a shell company and allowed the main trading business to go bust. In this case I was quoted a min of £2000 to chase it, and even if I won, I'd probably never see much of the money.

Personally I feel all these rules benefit the lawyers and solicitors. If stuff goes wrong, they're usually the ones who come up smelling of roses. Sorry if any of you are lawyers - but you know this is the case).

Anyway, I'm happy with the answers now. I've created a box with the relevant details of the seven day cooling off period etc. If a customer needs further help on it I can now just explain it.

I'm pretty good with most customers and see no real problem. But times being what they are, I thought it prudant to get my froms in order. RED TAPE, WHO NEEDS IT! Aghrr...

Thanks to everyone who posted. I think we can call this post answered. :T:T:T
Regards, Colin.

Depends what you mean by "chase". You can have a solicitor to write to a debtor for less than a hundred quid - use one of the online ones for just a few quid.
Debt collection agencies usually charge a setup fee of no more than a few hundred quid + commission on collecting the debt. Some may take a case on on a commission only basis.

If you mean to go to court, then it really depends if there is any kind of dispute - sums over £5k can get very expensive once solicitors get involved.

But if your chasing a ltd company about to close down then you need all the luck in the world.

arcon5

mo786uk wrote: »

This law was pretty much exclusive bought in to deal with rogue traders who go into peoples homes and pressure them into buying things.

Remember, the cancellation notice MUST contain the wording used in the law, so make sure it has all of it - otherwise it will not comply with the regulations.

A ssomeone else said, you can get smaples from TS websites.

I'd be very surprised if that was the case....

So long as the notice is clear and unambiguous I can't imagine it being thrown out

mo786uk

arcon5 wrote: »

I'd be very surprised if that was the case....

So long as the notice is clear and unambiguous I can't imagine it being thrown out

Regulation 7 tells you what it must have and it points to some information at the end of the legislation where you HAVE to use certain wording

it is to prevent people making the right to cancel hard to understand or hidden away.

squeaky

Section 7 ( http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2008/1816/regulation/7/made ) outlines what the company should state.

Section 8 ( http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2008/1816/regulation/8/made ) seems to cover what the customer needs to do.

This part of the MSE Shopping Article may help: http://www.moneysavingexpert.com/shopping/consumer-rights-refunds-exchange#web

arcon5

mo786uk wrote: »

Regulation 7 tells you what it must have and it points to some information at the end of the legislation where you HAVE to use certain wording

it is to prevent people making the right to cancel hard to understand or hidden away.

It tells you what must be included and how it's set out as not to basically screw over the consumer, but not the exact wording required.

I do though think what you meant by your post and how i've read it may have crossed wires

ukultra

Ok, one last point...

Because my stuff is personalized I'm providing the form which states they are custom made (not exact wording here) and to sign if they wish to go ahead with the order and begin the manufacture, informing them that they may be liable to costs up to that point, they sign this along with the order in the knowledge of said statement.

Now, when you read the leg on the gov site it says what you must do regarding placing a cancellation form, but it reads as if you only need to do this IF you are not in the exceptions. Although you do still need to have a box explaining about the fact that if they sign, they are liable to costs.

As with all gov regs its a little foggy about if you still need to provide it. I've seen many (large companies) that do not.

I'm printing orders as I need them onto duplicate paper, so having to print out extra stuff is a pain if I don't need it - I could print these separate though. Maybe ought to play it safe. They do after all still have the right to cancel but on the knowledge of costs. Mmmm. What a headache.
Shelf stacking at Tesco's is getting more appealing by the hour.

mo786uk

Think of your contract as three parts (but on one standard sheet).

Your own normal bit that gives details of the order and has your business details etc on it along with the details of the order.

You can design the above in whichever way you want.


The other 2 bits fulfil the requirements of the law.

The first must be headed 'NOTICE OF RIGHT TO CANCEL'
In this bit you must include all of the information as required in schedule 4 part 1 and 2. You must include the detachable form as shown in schedule 4 part 2.

(http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2008/1816/pdfs/uksi_20081816_en.pdf)

Secondly - you must obtain in writing from the consuemr the rigt to start the service/goods immediatley and make it clear they lose their right to cancel - the law says you have to do this but it doesnt give you the wording.

So I imagine it would be somehting like

'By signing this part of the form you acknowledge that we will start manufacture of the good immediatley. As these goods are made to your specificactions you will be liable for any costs incurred up until until the point that you cancel - this may be the full cost of the goods'

dontforget if you already have a written contract the cancellation notice MUST be a part of it and not seperate and the wording must be given as much prominence as everything else - not hidden away in small print.

make sure you get a full copy of the contract so you can prove 1) you gave them a cancellation notice and 2)they signed to say they wanted to go ahead.


You must still give them the full right to cancel when they agree the contract - they then sign the specific bit that says you can start ASAP. So do NOT get them to sign to start straight away without giving them the general cancellation bit.

hope that makes sense.

mo786uk

yes, you give them the form - they then decide whether they want the service to start ASAP and and sign the specific bit that says so. when it comes to services they still RETAIN their 7 day rights, but they are liable for any costs up until they cancel.

the law was mainly brought in to deal with rogue traders - for exmaple block pavers and tarmaccers. what the law allows if that you can have the service start ASAP but can still cancel after say 4 days and only pay upto costs incurred on day 4.

youe busines is slightly different as you are supply goods which may incur the full cost almost straight away.

ukultra

mo786uk wrote: »

yes, you give them the form - they then decide whether they want the service to start ASAP and and sign the specific bit that says so. when it comes to services they still RETAIN their 7 day rights, but they are liable for any costs up until they cancel.

Thanks again, that's how I'm going to do it. The customer will end up with the order including the terms/cancel notice.

I'm pretty good with customers when things go wrong (it happens now and then) so normally I'm pretty sure it would never get into a legal match. But now I should be covered and my customers are too. win win

Cheers!

ukultra

For anyone else reading this, I found this on the Law Society web-site.
lawsociety.org.uk/productsandservices/practicenotes/cancellingcontracts/5025.article (I can't post links yet)

Notice of the right to cancel

This Notice has been provided to you because you have entered into a contract to which the Cancellation of Contracts made in a Consumer's Home or Place of Work Regulations 2008 ('the Regulations') apply. The contract is for the supply to you of goods or services. The person providing the goods or services is referred to in the Regulations as 'the trader'.

Under the Regulations, you have the right to cancel this contract if you wish to do so. This Notice explains how to exercise this right. It also gives you other information that is required by the Regulations.

In order to exercise your right to cancel the contract, you need to deliver or send a cancellation notice, that is, a written notice that you wish to cancel the contract. You can use the cancellation form provided below if you wish, but you do not have to do so. You can send your notification by email if you prefer.

Any cancellation notice should be delivered or sent to [name of person] at [postal address] or at [email address] .

You have 7 days in which to serve a cancellation notice. The period of 7 days begins with the date when you receive this Notice. This 7 day period is referred to in the Regulations as 'the cancellation period'.

Under the Regulations, a cancellation notice is treated as being served as soon as it is sent or posted to the trader. A cancellation notice sent by electronic communication is treated as being served from the day when it is sent to the trader.

If you agree in writing that the performance of this contract should begin before the end of the cancellation period, then even if you cancel the contract you may still be required to pay for goods or services supplied before the cancellation.

If you enter into a related credit agreement, then that agreement will be automatically cancelled if the contract is cancelled. A 'related credit agreement' means an agreement under which fixed sum credit which fully or partly covers the price under the contract is granted to you by the trader, or by another person under an arrangement made between that person and the trader.

The identity of the trader providing goods or services under this contract is [insert name of solicitor or firm that is party to the contract, including any trading name]

The reference number, code or other details to enable the contract to be identified is [insert details]

This Notice is dated [insert date when the Notice is given to the client]

[You must include with the written Notice a cancellation form as a detachable slip, in accordance with the form set out in Schedule 4 Part II to the Regulations. Schedule 4 Part II is reproduced at Template 3 below. You must complete the cancellation form in accordance with the notes in Schedule 4 Part II, before you give the written notice to the client.]

(Complete, detach and return this form ONLY IF YOU WISH TO CANCEL THE CONTRACT.)

To: .. .. .. .. .. .. .. .. .. .. [trader to insert name and address of person to whom notice may be given.]

I/We (delete as appropriate) hereby give notice that I/we (delete as appropriate) wish to cancel my/our (delete as appropriate) contract .. .. .. .. .. .. .. .. .. .. [trader to insert reference number, code or other details to enable the contract or offer to be identified. He may also insert the name and address of the consumer.]

Signed

Name and Address

Date[/email]