T-Mobile- charging for not using PAC code

Jo_16

I called T Mobile in January to cancel as I wanted to get the I phone 4s from Three- (they offered me a better deal)

Spoke to the customer service who said that I would have to pay £86.37 to pay off the remainder of my contract, which i did over the phone I also checked with the CS guy that that was all i needed to pay -which he confirmed. I also asked for my PAC code as I wasn't sure if I wanted to keep my number. The CS guy I spoke to sent me this in a text message. He told me that it was valid for 30 days and if I didn't use it within this time I would need to call for another. ending the call under the impression that my contract with T Mobile was cancelled and all paid, I went and bought the I phone 4s with three, after thinking about it I decided not to keep my old number and start fresh with a new number. I sent my old phone off to a 'money for phone' scheme. Checking my bank on Friday I saw that TMobile have taken £35.95, I called TMobile CS straight away to query the charge. I was told that this was due to me not using the PAC code! and by not using it the cancellation notice I gave was no longer valid and my contract would continue, I explained that I was told when I cancelled that if I didn't use it within 30 days I would have to call for another at no point was i told that if I didn't use it i would continue to be charged. She said that if I want to cancel I will need to re issue my cancellation notice

I want to know if anyone else has experienced this? I cannot understand why 1) not using the PAC code affects my cancellation- surely this is my choice if I want to change my number or not? and 2) as I paid £86.37 why are they taking more money from me, if it is the case that i need to re issue my cancellation notice surely the £86.37 is sitting on the account as a credit?

Any help on this would be fantastic! Thank you!

grumbler

Yes, this is confusing, but unfortunately, this is how it works at all networks. If you request a PAC and don't use it, the contract continues. The only way to terminate a contract is

give a notice and not get a PAC.
OR
get a PAC (this works like giving a notice) and use it.

The clue was in this statement: " if I didn't use it within this time I would need to call for another". If the contract was terminated you wouldn't be able to "call for another" PAC.

robbies_gal

yes im afriad its right even though you paid out on your file they have you as receiving a pac that you didnt use so thew account just stays open

Cash-Strapped.T32

Thanks for the info you two - I too have been thinking about ditching T-Mo; While I would certainly intend to keep my #, it's good to know the dodgy* tricks involved.


* Dodgy in that while I'm sure it's technically legal, the OP appears to have paid-off the entire bill, so if I were him I would still be coming back to T-Mo for a refund as it appears he/she *has* given notice.
(this is separate to the point that cancelling mid billing-period will incur the rest of that period's charges)


Whether or not the PAC was actually used, notice was given, which ought to be plenty by my understanding of the Ts & Cs.

The PAC is merely a mechanism to port a phone number, not to terminate a financial contract (as proven by all the posters who come on here wanting to get out of their contracts early & being told rightly that they can't without paying for the remainder of said contract).

While I know you're right in that the telcos prefer to use this mechanism as a type of notice, saying the words "this is my notice, please cancel my account" has got to be enough to give notice - Otherwise contracts in all kinds of business or other walks of life would run on forever & ever.

The clue was in this statement: " if I didn't use it within this time I would need to call for another". If the contract was terminated you wouldn't be able to "call for another" PAC.

I take Grumbs' point on board, but I think you can't be expected to "read between the lines" in these circumstances; Indeed, a contract exists precisely to make it crystal clear where those lines lay, to provide no room for personal interpretation, for people to claim they didn't understand their terms - And to hold both parties to those terms.


I know it's a left-field example, but take a woman who's being stalked or harassed.
She might well cancel the contract, pay off any remainder & give notice according to her Ts & Cs, request a PAC but then later opt not to use her PAC (for obvious and perfectly legitimate reasons).
Is she expected to keep paying for a service she has legitimately cancelled?

Ok, companies can't build their systems around every variety of human society, but neither should they use such obscure technicalities to keep charging you after legitimate notice is given and accepted.

I'd love to hear how this plays out, because I feel it's a really dishonest business practice.
Best of luck OP! :cool:

grumbler

Cash-Strapped.T32 wrote: »

...
I take Grumbs' point on board, but I think you can't be expected to "read between the lines" in these circumstances;...

So do I: PAC Codes and Oranges Way to Stop You Cancelling

because I feel it's a really dishonest business practice.

Maybe 'dishonest' is a too strong word, but it certainly is confusing, if not misleading.

Cash-Strapped.T32

Yowser! :eek:

So after reading that thread, basically what we're saying is that a mobile phone contract is pretty much unique among financial instruments in that a mechanism to move your 11-digit number can interfere with the standard practice of contracts (ie; no means no), and as long as they post it somewhere among the long grass of their maze like help pages, it's fully legit...


While I cannot disagree with your logic, I suddenly find myself with a lot more sympathy for those who "try it on" with Telcos, which is a real shame as anything that increases lack of trust & suspicion of contracts can only be a bad thing for the whole notion of contracts & honouring your financial obligations.


I guess that when I leave T-Mo I'd be best off getting them to downgrade my sim-only account to a PAYG one, leave it a month for my final bill to be paid, cancel the D-Debit or make a one-off payment prior to the Debit-Date, and then do the number porting hot shoe shuffle, giving them no possibility to bill me if things go mammaries-upwards.

Oh, and record everything.


PAYG options such as GiffGaff are looking more attractive to me now.
Cheers for putting me right mate, although I really wish it were not the case.

Jo_16

Thank you your advise and support, all I am worried about is that they are going to charge me again for another notice period, even though I paid £86.37 which was pay of till the end of the contract in April. surely they will be able to see on their screen that I have already paid until the end of my contract, are they allowed to take more money which is for the same period?

Thanks

Ferris

Cash-Strapped.T32 wrote: »

Yowser! :eek:

I guess that when I leave T-Mo I'd be best off getting them to downgrade my sim-only account to a PAYG one, leave it a month for my final bill to be paid, cancel the D-Debit or make a one-off payment prior to the Debit-Date, and then do the number porting hot shoe shuffle, giving them no possibility to bill me if things go mammaries-upwards.

a point to note is that in order to downgrade to PAYG you now need to buy £10 credit. i was in this position in november. it was especially rubbish as i had an existing sim-only contract which i wanted to end as i had a new 24-month t-mobile contract.

arguably it is still safer to move to PAYG. but the safest (and cheapest!) option of all would be to grab a free disposable PAYG sim for any other network and 'park' the number there until you're ready to move it.

grumbler

Jo_16 wrote: »

Thank you your advise and support, all I am worried about is that they are going to charge me again for another notice period, even though I paid £86.37 which was pay of till the end of the contract in April. surely they will be able to see on their screen that I have already paid until the end of my contract, are they allowed to take more money which is for the same period?

[STRIKE]In short, yes, they are allowed if the minimum term of your contract expired. You are on 1 month rolling contract now and if you give a notice today you have to pay from the last day you have already paid for till the 13th of March.[/STRIKE]

No you don't have to pay anything more. If you give a notice today you have to pay until the 13th of March, but you have already paid until April.