EDF Fail Ofgem Direct Debit Rules

Terrylw1

jalexa wrote: »

For the moment I think this is still the best thread for the post. Just noticed reference to a new and improved bill format. http://www.edfenergy.com/products-services/for-your-home/my-account/Better_Bill_Customer_guide.pdf

For the "expert" there is a lot of info but I think it will leave most customers baffled. The cynic in me says satisfying the regulator is the issue. In respect of DD calculation I would say that perhaps SLC27.14 (basis of calculation) may be satisfied but it does not satisfy me on SLC27.15. There is a very telling section (16 in the "interim" direct debit bill)...

"Your comparative usage

This section shows the projected cost of your household’s energy next year if you use the same as in the last 12 months. It is for comparison purposes and does not reflect your DD amount, which takes into account the weather, your balance, and where you are in your annual cycle"

The bill doesn't give the assumed projected consumption, the energy split or state which weather station data has been used, a real "hostage to fortune". I feel an email request coming on.

Just perhaps they mean they apply the appropriate "profile", e.g standard for gas, Class 1 for electricity, in which case "weather" is not the correct word. Who knows, and the new improved bill doesn't say, IMO a SLC27.15 fail. It is interesting that British Gas have adopted a "billing for dummies" format. Edf Energy has gone the other may. Billing for "geeks", even if I say so myself.:D

The supplier can't base it on weather, other than to:

- having a % variable that varies across the year, even daily.

- using the industry data that's already out there i.e. EAC, AQ, etc.

The weather station data is used in the industry data. This is used to create Daily Profile Coefficients (DPC) that are used in the EAC/AA processes the Data Collector uses in elec. Not sure on gas.

I don't believe any supplier is contacting weather stations or learning how to use DPC's (which are outside of the suppliers market role) when there is a fully proven, compliant & audited system in place.

jalexa

Terrylw1 wrote: »

The supplier can't base it on weather, other than to:

- having a % variable that varies across the year, even daily.

- using the industry data that's already out there i.e. EAC, AQ, etc.

I tend to agree with that, but "weather" is the word used in the explanation. Anyway it is a "hostage to fortune" which is simply an opportunity to ask a customer service question which I anticipate will not be easily answered short of Complaint. If that is what Edf Energy wants so be it.

What I can say is that my Midata consumption projections show an alarming increase completely unsubstantiated by previous actual annual consumption or recent monthly customer reads.

Need to research the DPC that you mention.

Terrylw1

jalexa wrote: »

I tend to agree with that, but "weather" is the word used in the explanation. Anyway it is a "hostage to fortune" which is simply an opportunity to ask a customer service question which I anticipate will not be easily answered short of Complaint. If that is what Edf Energy wants so be it.

What I can say is that my Midata consumption projections show an alarming increase completely unsubstantiated by previous actual annual consumption or recent monthly customer reads.

Need to research the DPC that you mention.

It will probably be a miracle just to find anyone in customer services or complaints who knows much or even anything about things like EAC's.

Even in a back office, it would be hard.

These areas are highly specialised and link into lots of other processes so they tend to be held in areas where teams work on industry level issues, agent liaison, etc.

A change like that us likely to have gone through a Waterfall style change management process where they send out the requirements/summaries to an audience who work in these areas, whilst the project team/IS side just implement/roll out, etc.

Terrylw1

I think I put this doc and another one regarding weather in an earlier post.

I think the supplier does get these, I could check. I don't think they would use them though. From my experience, it would be a struggle to find anyone who understands these in a supplier but since these guys often own the Data Collectors, they could source the experts from there.

https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&q=cache:SyFpkmj-130J:www.elexon.co.uk/ELEXON%2520Documents/load_profiles.pdf+daily+profile+coefficients&hl=en&pid=bl&srcid=ADGEEShHSOT91qb5boV8Ii3zioFvGB-sdzmqukrKBjtBADRKWMz92Vw0mvZH38uEgLTLaZ2X0IfB0FrSue7kYbyB7mrFhhBx1CX7kxKPx2dipVX9igTlAE6F0VNdHXDgtIeb7MxqtoFJ&sig=AHIEtbT2xO4qHq8NddMxQbyJqvhshfVbTA

victor2

Well, the EDF Blue +Price tariff I pre-signed up for was due to kick in today as my Fixed S@ver tariff ended yesterday. Gave them readings on the 28th, just to be safe - didn't actually get a bill or DD recalc!
Anyway, checked my online account this morning and it said I was on their standard tariff. Phoned them up, got through immediately to a very helpful lady, who said she'd seen a few online changes for the new tariff not go through. Gave me her direct email address to forward the confirmation email I got from their site to, and within 5 minutes she emailed back to say it was sorted. Sure enough, I checked my account and it now says I'm on the Blue +Price April 2014 tariff. They haven't adjusted my DD (yet). It's actually a few pounds low to cover my annual usage at the new rate, but my account is in credit more than enough to cover the difference, so I'll leave it and see what happens.

jalexa

Terrylw1 wrote: »

I think I put this doc and another one regarding weather in an earlier post.

Thanks for that, I think I missed it first time:(. TBH I apply the Class 1 profile and stop at that. Happy to consider whatever "fiddling factors" the supplier applies but I insist that they tell me.

I think you are right not many people would understand much beyond Class 1 monthly.

Also, its really an understanding of gas that we need as the seasonal factors are much greater.

jalexa

An update.

Couldn't resist the prospect of the new improved statement confidently touted on the home page. Submitted reads, no DD recalculation:T but boo hoo got the old format statement not the new improved statement.:(

The future 12 month consumption projections on this statement are coming into line with the previous 12 month actuals:T which I believe is a sounder baseline than previous "imagination" figures.

Had another look at the "new improved statement". It uses the word "debt" to describe a statement debit balance but I do not believe a direct debit payment scheme debit balance is a "debt". So a bill designer has used the word "debt", and every stage of sign-off has endorsed the word. That is shocking. Perhaps it has not translated well from a cheapskate developer's language?

More seriously, (also a feature of the current statement format), the 12 month future consumption projection (note not used for the DD calculation) is presented in accurate arithmetic detail, but the basis for the DD cost projection is completely unsubstantiated. So (for the customer) hardly an "improved statement".

I remain of the view the "new improved statement" remains a SLC27.15 fail. Given that the DD cost projection is not substantiated I have revised my working position and now consider the "new improved statement" is also a SLC27.14 fail, to be contested via the Complaints procedure should I ever be subjected to an unsubstantiated DD recalculation.

As far as the post "Title" is concerned, I cannot answer the question except to say the "new improved statement" appears to me to be a "poor p*ssoir" piece of work.

Note to the MSE net nanny: A "p i s s o i r" is a French sanitary appliance. And being outdoors not particularly unpleasant or culturally "inappropriate".

victor2

I also got the old style bill generated from readings I entered on 29 Sep. BUT, no DD recalculation, which is a first for me!
Funny thing is my DD should be increased slightly to cover the same usage I've had in the last 12 months, but not if you take into account the current credit balance I have.
Their forecasted consumption for the next 12 months is inexplicably 10% higher than the last. The predicted cost does agree with the Blue +Price tariff I'm now on though.
I'll just leave it as it is for now and see what happens when I enter readings next month.
It does say the next bill will be available in My Account in May 2013, wonder if it will generate a bill for me next month?

Toxteth_OGrady

The forecast usage on my Annual Statement from my 30th September bill shows I will have an estimated 30% increase in gas consumption compared with my actual over the last 12 months. Glad I'm leaving EDF tbh.

rednblack

Hi all,

Can I ask a question re DD? When paying by DD are you expected to pay for your utilities in advance?

I ask because I received a bill from EDF last week saying my monthly payment will increase from £65 to £93, despite me being pretty much even (the bill said I was £64 in debt, but only a few days before my DD was due) and my annual usage only being £796 (ie. £66.33 a month). Their argument is that I will not be paying enough to cover my usage over the winter period.

Also, my annual review is March, and they put it up now because I wouldn't let them put it up to £73 in March (which I do feel justified in doing). It seems convenient my annual review is after the winter!


They have today come back with an offer to put it up to £70 a month if I pay £120 now to cover the shortfall! (I had offered to pay any debt in March and then start again from scratch)

I did have a bit of a moan and probably didn't endear myself to them, but am I wrong to expect no more than a couple of quid increase?