Banks and Power of Attorney

Floydsdad

My mum has a Lasting Power of Attorney naming me, my brother and my sister as attorneys for her. The PoA specifies that we can act individually on transactions of less than £4k, but all of us need to authorise a transaction above that amount.

She has current accounts at both Natwest and HSBC, and neither bank will provide us attorneys with phone or internet banking access as "there are three joint attorneys". It makes it hard to manage mum's finances as anything, even checking a balance, requires a visit to a branch.

Will any other bank provide us with phone / internet banking on a current account, following the terms of the PoA? Or will they all take the same stance as Natwest and HSBC?

We were planning on closing one of the accounts anyway, we would be happy to close both and move elsewhere.

le_loup

Change the POA.
Either there is trust, or there is not. I cannot see any financial institution being happy to comply with such complexity.

alanq

Complex arrangements may be desired for maximum protection but banks will not wish to be involved in complex arrangements in case there is a slip up and they are held liable. (They don't have a good record for always getting simple things right!)

I don't see how banks are expected to organise a three-party authorisation by phone or internet for a transaction!

le_loup wrote: »

Change the POA.

Only possible if mother still has mental capacity to agree to it and at a financial cost and time delay.

jonesMUFCforever

Look at it from the bank's point of view they allow you to have internet access - you transfer say £5k into one of your own accounts - in breach of the PoA then the other attorney gets wind of it and blames the bank!

le_loup

alanq wrote: »

Only possible if mother still has mental capacity to agree to it .

That's why the Court of Protection is there. True it will cost, the alternative being an unworkable arrangement.

Biggles

My brother and I were "jointly and severally" (the old wording) Attorneys for my mother's Enduring Power of Attorney, and Lloyds had no problems granting me online access. My brother was happy to let me do the day-to-day management of the account and I kept him supplied with details of transactions on a regular basis and we discussed any large transactions in advance.

le_loup

Not with a value limit!

Floydsdad

Thanks for all your replies, folks.

Mum doesn't have the mental capacity any longer to re-do the PoA, and none of us want to go down the Court of Protection route unless we need to.

The actual terms in the PoA are: "My attorneys must act jointly in relation to decisions about disposal of assets and investments, including selling my house, and distribution of my income. They must act jointly when making any payments greater than £4000. They may act jointly or severally on routine financial matters such as paying household bills, including any bills that arise out of my care arrangements."

At the time we all felt this was the right way to keep everything on the straight and narrow while providing the flexibility for one of us to manage the day to day finances. With the benefit of hindsight, we could have worded that better.

I guess we'll just have to live with the arrangements, unless there really is an alternative.

dzug1

One (faint) possibility is will they give your mother internet access? After all, the donor retains the right to manage their affairs to the extent that they feel fit and able. Granting PoA does not take that right away.

alanq

How are things working at the moment? Is it 3 signatures on a cheque?

Do you have cash cards? You probably wouldn't be able to make a transaction of > £4k with one of those. They would allow you to check balances at any ATM instead of visiting branch. With a debit card things may be more awkward as some ATMs allow bill payments.

Floydsdad

Mum doesn't have the mental capacity to make her own application for internet banking, let alone actually use it. (Dementia is an awful illness).

One of us attorneys has a debit card for the Natwest account, which does work, although we haven't tried it for a >£4k transaction as yet. Granted we can use that in an ATM, but the nearest one is still 5 miles away, and even a Natwest ATM can only be used to withdraw cash and check a balance.

Both banks have accepted and cleared cheques signed by just one attorney for <£4k, so that appears to work as well.