Greece...

Mistermeaner

Guess it's good for UK to kind of be uninvolved?

At least until Germany invade poland

BlondeHeadOn

ggb1979 wrote: »

Guess it's good for UK to kind of be uninvolved?

At least until Germany invade poland

This made me laugh out loud - and then feel a bit guilty for laughing!

Kendall80

ggb1979 wrote: »

Guess it's good for UK to kind of be uninvolved?

At least until Germany invade poland

...or Belgium

Kendall80

Fortunately it would appear that only 85% need to vote in favour for a bailout to be agreed. Individual country vote weightings are not even however, ranked according to their bailout contribution. Therefore finland and Slovakia etc can bark all they like but the bigger powers still have enough to carry the vote. The Germans will likely have the final say. A letter has been doing the rounds though from the Germans that state they will ask for a conditional 5 year euro Grexit before releasing further funds. Note thats euro grexit not EU.

Sapphire

BlondeHeadOn wrote: »

This made me laugh out loud - and then feel a bit guilty for laughing!

So you should.

dktreesea

Graham_Devon wrote: »

No, but BOE ntoes are not legal tender in Scotland either.

Scottish banknotes (and BOE notes) ARE a legal currency though.

You are being a little pedantic here, as legal tender has little relevancy to todays economy.

I travel between Scotland and England quite a lot. Every now and again someone doesn't accept the other country's currency. So we take English notes to spend down south and change them into coins before we cross the border. Banks will change them on either side of the border for the local currency, but it's a hassle.

dktreesea

Kendall80 wrote: »

Fortunately it would appear that only 85% need to vote in favour for a bailout to be agreed. Individual country vote weightings are not even however, ranked according to their bailout contribution. Therefore finland and Slovakia etc can bark all they like but the bigger powers still have enough to carry the vote. The Germans will likely have the final say. A letter has been doing the rounds though from the Germans that state they will ask for a conditional 5 year euro Grexit before releasing further funds. Note thats euro grexit not EU.

The Germans have got a real cheek. They wanted the Euro because prior to that most of southern Europe couldn't afford to buy their exports. So having voted Greece into the Eurozone (thank goodness the Brits weren't stupid enough to ditch the pound), not to mention enjoying the way southern citizens then overdosed on cheap lending and bought up German exports they previously couldn't afford, they now don't want to fund the other side of the coin? Now they don't want to pay for the type of infrastructure the Greeks would need to even host German factories Slovakia and Slovenia style, let alone achieve a similar level of prosperity?


Yes, they think the Greeks are corrupt, lazy, all the rest of it. But on the other hand the Germans now look like economic terrorists. What gives them the right to bankrupt another country? After all, they were the chief promoters of the Euro. They're the ones who rolled out the invitation to Greece.


No wonder countries like the UK, Switzerland and Sweden didn't join the Eurozone. Germany is acting like a dictator.

Generali

dktreesea wrote: »

The Germans have got a real cheek. They wanted the Euro because prior to that most of southern Europe couldn't afford to buy their exports. So having voted Greece into the Eurozone (thank goodness the Brits weren't stupid enough to ditch the pound), not to mention enjoying the way southern citizens then overdosed on cheap lending and bought up German exports they previously couldn't afford, they now don't want to fund the other side of the coin? Now they don't want to pay for the type of infrastructure the Greeks would need to even host German factories Slovakia and Slovenia style, let alone achieve a similar level of prosperity?


Yes, they think the Greeks are corrupt, lazy, all the rest of it. But on the other hand the Germans now look like economic terrorists. What gives them the right to bankrupt another country? After all, they were the chief promoters of the Euro. They're the ones who rolled out the invitation to Greece.


No wonder countries like the UK, Switzerland and Sweden didn't join the Eurozone. Germany is acting like a dictator.

And lest we forget, Germany is a serial defaulter:

http://affairstoday.co.uk/top-6-defaults-remembered/

Germany has defaulted eight times since 1800 according to Reinhart and Rogoff, placing it amongst the worst serial defaulters. One of the most commonly invoked defaults in historiography is the series of default episodes that were triggered by Germany from 1931 to 1933. Under the Treaty of Versailles, Germany was forced to pay significant amounts in war reparations. After several instances, with the –possibly – deliberate inability of Germany to pay its debts throughout the ‘20s, the country even received financial assistance from the US to pay the reparations. For Albrecht Ritschl, an economic historian, Germany has been the ‘biggest debt transgressor of 20th century’. Mr. Ritschl goes as far as to suggest that the 1930s German sovereign default outweighs the 2008 Great Recession. What really happened in Germany was that after the Wall Street Crash of 1929, Germany saw the US assistance coming to a halt, and money was actually flowing out of the country. It was the US that decided on a voluntary haircut to the German debt, regardless of the fact that the country’s pattern of refusing to pay its creditors was replicated by later governments, finally culminating on May 6 1933, when Adolf Hitler repudiated long-term debt obligations.
The foreign debt default in this case has little commonality with the other cases with respect to its economic repercussions for the country, the lack of supportive institutional framework and indeed its political symbolism. This case stands on this list due to its historical significance, being the catalyst of the rise to power of one of the most oppressive regimes and, by extension, of the deadliest war humanity has ever known.

worldtraveller

Generali wrote: »

They 'hid' about EUR8bn of debt with the infamous Goldman Swap. Beggur all in the grand scheme of things.

Goldman Sachs faces the prospect of potential legal action from Greece over the complex financial deals in 2001 that many blame for its subsequent debt crisis.

The Independent

Graham_Devon

The BBC's Andrew Neil is stating that Germany want Greece to park £50bn of assets in Germany in order that germany can privatise them (and presumably take the profits).

Thats not a bailout, it's a raid.

And as I assumed earlier, a 3rd bailout will also include Brussels taking over public administration in Greece.