Photographed & Fined in a yellow box at traffic lightss

Coupon-mad

I had a look, I am SchoolRunMum over there.

TFL's latest letter tells you what to do. Either pay £65 now or do an 'all or nothing appeal' to PATAS for £130 or nowt. The forms are with the letters, you just need to get your wording right - and rather than replying on a postal decision (dodgy as you cannot steer it your way nor answer questions) the registered keeper should attend the PATAS hearing - is that possible if that's your Dad?

Your main point I think is that your parents have a flawed PCN as Hillcats pointed out. He linked his thread for you - if it's not clear what wording he or others with similar PCNs have used then why not send him a pm to ask, he is on MSE as well. Lots and lots of cases have been won over this flawed wording but be warned there is at least one adjudicator who disagrees. So whilst the chances of winning on that point, when properly argued, are good, they are of course not guaranteed.

You also asked the following, my answers in blue:

Can one argue:

1) They where keeping up with traffic and it was dangerous to stop
or something to that effect

Nope, forget that, that's the point of a box junction that you DON'T just keep up. To say that would be almost admitting the contravention I think. They should have moved into the outside lane before the motorbike got there.

In fact IMHO and you COULD argue on that (different) point - that the way was clear (outside lane) when they entered the box but then a motorbike overtook them in the outside lane which then stopped them from changing lnto that clear lane (which was of course their intention...). That said, you'd need to watch the video to know that was the case, and Dad would have to be primed. And don't suggest it in any way on pepipoo unless it's true...on pepipoo they only deal with the truth which is a laudable approach.

2) My mother has mentioned that a vehicle with sirens was approaching.

(Whether it did end up coming the same road, or appeared from the distance to be coming down the road she was on (eg it turned off at the last moinute) I do not know...ill need to check with her exactly what happened)

Yep, worth stating to the adjudicator as it can't do any harm and you may be lucky, but was it mentioned to the Council? You can introduce new info but PATAS may wonder why if it wasn't said earlier and would not have given the Council a chance to check that out. It can be checked and if the Council were told this point and ignored it then you can restate it in the PATAS appeal and ask why emergency services records were not checked, did they even give any consideration to that point.

3) One of my parents has a serious medical conditions and they have been going to town every week for 6 months, my mother wondered if by mentioning this, Transport For London will be lenient

You could have asked for mitigating circumstances to be considered by the Council but not at PATAS as far as I know, because an adjudicator can only find on facts.


Hope that helps - on pepipoo you will get more replies if, after reading Hillcats thread and other TFL box junction threads (there are LOTS) you could use that info to draft your appeal wording and paste it up on pepipoo in a reply asking for comments. Do that mid-evening today or evening tomorrow - which is the best time IMHO to post on pepipoo as it's the busiest time for replies.

Your latest post was a bit early in the day and - as the forum is so busy - ends up on page 2 and overlooked by the evening. So you do need to work on your draft after reading other similar threads which are easily found on Google or by looking back or searching on pepipoo.