current tenants not answering calls from letting agent to book viewings!!

grey_lady

bikingbarney wrote: »

communication works both ways though, if they were struggling for the rent then they could of called me or the agent to explain what was going on and perhaps we could of helped out.

but the blatant lies and the ignoring of calls and letters leaves me very frustrated.

even the guarantor is ignoring the agent now

Yes - and who is in the proverbial here?

You might think that they are in the wrong by lying/ignoring calls/letters but who does that help? they are burying their head in the sand and as you've found out on here they are within their legal rights.
You still have a communication problem and your relying on a useless agent and tenant with their head on the sand to fix things - instead of fixing them yourself :-)

Bw - why are you still giving your (useless) agent the time of day?

Werdnal

BitterAndTwisted wrote: »

Notice that "IF" Barney

I'm with you on this one B&T!

OP, did you issue the S21 yourself, or did you leave your clueless agents to do it? Do you know if they have done it correctly, with all dates and details of the tenancy correct - having not covered themselves in glory so far, I wonder ... if they failed to do it right, then your trip to court will be waste of time for all concerned.

Do you know if agents have protected the tenant's deposit and issued tenant with the prescribed information confirming the deposit protection details? If not, check asap, otherwise the S21 is invalid already.

BitterAndTwisted

grey_lady wrote: »

Yes - and who is in the proverbial here?

You might think that they are in the wrong by lying/ignoring calls/letters but who does that help? they are burying their head in the sand and as you've found out on here they are within their legal rights.
You still have a communication problem and your relying on a useless agent and tenant with their head on the sand to fix things - instead of fixing them yourself :-)

Bw - why are you still giving your (useless) agent the time of day?

Harsh lady, very harsh. Perhaps for a newbie landlord a useless agent is better than no agent at all when you're just starting out? People who are well-informed and experienced rarely get themselves stuck with a carp representatives.

The time for giving the OP a clip round the ear is probably after this mess has been cleaned up.

As the agent appears to have secured the last two months rent, perhaps the agent is not quite as useless as they sound?

tbs624

tbs624 wrote: »

He is *either* a permitted occupier or he is a T with joint and several liability. Which is it?

Note that if they are claiming HB/LHA you should be copying your rent statement to the local LHA office too so that they are aware that the Ts themselves are not paying their rent.

In certain circumstances you can apply to have it paid direct to you but if any part of their claim turns out to be fraudulent the money gets clawed back from you rather than them.

OP - you didn't answer this query from a previous post.

Note that if husband *is* merely a permitted occupier and wife is the T then it is the wife whom you pursue for unpaid rent and costs arising from any damage to the property. You as LL effectively have no contract with a PO

If husband* is* merely a PO -as you say the wife is not working , but the husband is, why did the LA arrange the AST agreement this way?

I hope that the guarantor deed is in order should you need to rely on it in court proceedings.

For the time being focus on keeping up the *written* ( copies kept) pressure for the rent payments to be brought up to date.

Does your tenancy agreement/guarantor agreement have a specific clause covering the application of a reasonable fee for late payment?

Don't be surprised by inadequacies on the part of your LA - *anyone* can set themselves up in business as an LA. There is no formal requirement for them to be regulated, to have any training or qualifications or even previous relevant experience.

As B&T says, check and double check the service/timing of that S21 and find out now, for definite, whether the LA sent the scheme's prescribed information to the Ts.

You can personally check online that the deposit is definitely registered - TDS, DPS, mydeposits. If the deposit is not registered, or if it is registered but LA cannot *prove* that the T received the prescribed info, then the matter should be properly dealt with pronto and your S21 re-served as the original one would be invalid.

You have to accept that possibility of there being a void - but it is far simpler to get a new T when the current ones have gone. Even if a potential T was mad enough to fully sign up for a tenancy without seeing the interior of the property you do not want the added hassle of being unable to give them possession of the property because the current Ts avail themselves of the right to sit tight until a court order is obtained/bailiffs are brought in.

grey_lady

Ok I really didnt mean to sound harsh - i was just trying to underline the point that communicating with the tenant is important - and being proactive rather than expecting the tenant to contact the LL/agent to have the awkward conversation as to why they can't pay the rent.
It sounds like there is no communication between the guarentor now and the agent!

Im still suprised that the agent recommended going with a tenant who had an outstanding ccj, and not getting rent guarentee insurance - others have pointed out other reasons on this thread why they think the agent is below par.

sooz

tbs624 wrote: »

OP - you didn't answer this query from a previous post.

Note that if husband *is* merely a permitted occupier and wife is the T then it is the wife whom you pursue for unpaid rent and costs arising from any damage to the property. You as LL effectively have no contract with a PO

If husband* is* merely a PO -as you say the wife is not working , but the husband is, why did the LA arrange the AST agreement this way?

I hope that the guarantor deed is in order should you need to rely on it in court proceedings.

For the time being focus on keeping up the *written* ( copies kept) pressure for the rent payments to be brought up to date.

Does your tenancy agreement/guarantor agreement have a specific clause covering the application of a reasonable fee for late payment?

Don't be surprised by inadequacies on the part of your LA - *anyone* can set themselves up in business as an LA. There is no formal requirement for them to be regulated, to have any training or qualifications or even previous relevant experience.

As B&T says, check and double check the service/timing of that S21 and find out now, for definite, whether the LA sent the scheme's prescribed information to the Ts.

You can personally check online that the deposit is definitely registered - TDS, DPS, mydeposits. If the deposit is not registered, or if it is registered but LA cannot *prove* that the T received the prescribed info, then the matter should be properly dealt with pronto and your S21 re-served as the original one would be invalid.

You have to accept that possibility of there being a void - but it is far simpler to get a new T when the current ones have gone. Even if a potential T was mad enough to fully sign up for a tenancy without seeing the interior of the property you do not want the added hassle of being unable to give them possession of the property because the current Ts avail themselves of the right to sit tight until a court order is obtained/bailiffs are brought in.

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/3684981

See posts 36 & 40

They are both tenant and permitted occupier!

The agent messed up the tenancy agreement, & by the looks of it the s21 is invalid too.

BitterAndTwisted

Ay caramba! I've just read those two posts.

Barney! BARNEY! You were advised in the strongest possible terms to JOIN A LANDLORDS ASSOCIATION on the 21dst of December. You've had WEEKS to get that sorted. It takes five minutes online so I've heard. Have you?



Those sods will be there until summer-time at this rate.....

bikingbarney

BitterAndTwisted wrote: »

Ay caramba! I've just read those two posts.

Barney! BARNEY! You were advised in the strongest possible terms to JOIN A LANDLORDS ASSOCIATION on the 21dst of December. You've had WEEKS to get that sorted. It takes five minutes online so I've heard. Have you?



Those sods will be there until summer-time at this rate.....

Thanks yep got round to joining the NLA a week or so ago.

I know this sounds a bit naive and it will probably go pete tong but on the advice of the letting agent I havent done anything about the s21 only being in one name in the hope they move out quietly!!

Also when i questioned the agent about the one lad being listed as a tenant and also a permitted occupier they couldnt answer me and just said "sorry"

As I have everything here in black and white (the mistakes by the agent that is) do you think the agent would be liable to me if it does go wrong??

Thanks

Steve

tbs624

sooz wrote: »

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/3684981

See posts 36 & 40

They are both tenant and permitted occupier!

The agent messed up the tenancy agreement, & by the looks of it the s21 is invalid too.

Thanks sooz - this is the problem when folk have several threads on the go.

bikingbarney - it's a risk to rely on that S21. As you say, you may get lucky but if they are listed on the tenancy agreement as joint tenants then both names should appear on the notice, ideally with both being given their own copy.

If it was me, I would re-serve.

Your LA appears to be an A grade plonker. Sort the repossession of the property and unpaid rent and then ditch the fool. Then trawl through your contract with him and formally notify him of all his shortcomings accompanied by a request for appropriate financial recompense..

sooz

At least you have joined the Nla.

Now, have you actually rung them & asked for help?

Do not rely on anything the agent says. He's a prat, who obviously knows nothing about anything.

You appear to have 'professional' tenants. Not in a good way

One not working, one with a ccj, guarantor who ignores you & pays up when they reach 2 months of arrears.

Reserve that section 21 with the nla's help, & do it properly this time.

Get all the paperwork from the agent, & ditch them ASAP.

Don't readvertise, as you won't get this lot out easily.