Benefit fraud - do i need a lawyer?

suelees1

I can obviously only give you overall general advice here.

Criminal lawyers have little actual technical knowledge of the benefit system. In our firm the criminal lawyers work with our social welfare team which specialises in social security law. We would normally look at whether the amount was correct or if there was any entitlement to other benefits which weren't claimed at the time and which could be notionally offset again the overpayment. This would in essence minimise the loss to the public purse.

We would also look at whether the period they wish to recover is correct. The DWP frequently try to recover benefit paid to claimants AFTER they have started investigating when in reality this shouldn't happen.

Additionally I'd also advise that the money you were holding 'in trust' for your sister be mentioned in the statement even though there's nothing in writing.

You certainly need a statement in mitigation so I really would suggest you speak to someone who knows what they're talking about and see if you can get representation. The CAB do NOT rep for criminal proceedings. Try the LSC on the following link as they might be able to point you in the right direction.

In summary there are issues relating to state benefits (civil) and fraud (crime) here so two experts working in both disciplines need to liaise with each other.

http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Dl1/Directories/UsefulContactsByCategory/Governmentcitizensandrightscontacts/DG_195356

When did you get your actual overpayment decision and did you appeal it ? If not I would consider submitting a late appeal as rogerblack suggests. Any civil appeal should always be heard before the criminal case. The fraud case should be adjourned until the final decision on the actual benefit overpayment.

To be honest the CAB should have gone into all this detail with you.

suelees1

microfilm1 wrote: »

if you didnt get caught would you have owned up anyway or maybe too depressed.

Snide remark

dawyldthing

for the money that your sister gave you is there a paper chase ie did you receive it by cheque or straight from her bank to your bank? As this may help you prove it was hers all along.

Morglin

Before making a decision on a lawyer, it might be worth talking to someone legally qualified, first:

http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Governmentcitizensandrights/GettingLegalAdvice/Gettinglegaladviceandlegalaid/DG_195416

Lin

Mara69

suelees1 wrote: »

Snide remark

I thought it was a reasonable question. OP is being (deliberately?) vague with a lot of responses and having read the whole thread I am starting to lean towards fraud as opposed to an honest mistake.

I would definitely advise getting a solicitor. OP can obviously afford it and she may 'enjoy' a greater level of leniency with the help of a qualified solicitor.

x4xy

DAWILDTHING, No, unfortunately there is no paper chase of my sister's money. I already said this. if I had it I would have given it at the iuc...

SUELESS1 thanks for pointing out the two aspects, civil and criminal. To be honest is the criminal one that really worries me especially as there is no paper chase.

I still feel I will plead guilty. Simple because the strain is just too much
you really need to be mentally strong with this and I am not sure I can carry it out.

heathcote123

x4xy wrote: »

i admitted in the iuc that there was an overpayment - but the big problem seem to be they will want to prove that I acted dishonestly while this is not the case as I never used it for any purpose whatsoever.

Did you give it back then?

x4xy

well - to daily haters mentioned by wouldbequality saver - I'll say I could not make a call to get anyone to help me with rats living in my kitchen for three years either, some of them dead on the floor for six months... and I could not make a call to the samaritans either when I was suicidal even though I was full of leaflets from them... Have these people tried to ask around how depressrion works? which I have had for at least 20 years and at least eleven years on daily medication... I did call once DWP asking to go through my application - but the lady said it's all right, don't worry...

System

x4xy wrote: »

I have to go to court at the beginning of february charghed with benefit fraud. In the IUC I admitted there has been an overpayment of £16,000 income support and said I would pay it back. I have already put in place direct debits to pay it all back... My mitigating circustances are that I have been deeply in depression and on long term heavy medications (11 years) and I just did not give a damn about what happened to my life, i was living with rats, never washing myself or cleaning my home, etc... for a period of 3 years. I have not used this overpayment for anything or to buy anything or lead a glamorous lifestyle at all. I was just too ill/irrespsonisble to tell them to stop paying me...
I will not be getting legal aid - because of an inheritance - (not much but above the limit) so I wonder if it is worth hiring a lawyer for me to just plead guilty and say the above to the court in mitigation as I was asked £4,000 by one lawyer.
If I had to hire a lawyer should I hire him to take up the whole case or just to come to court with me?
I'd be grateful for any suggestions, especially if they were ASAP.

How on earth did you get overpaid £16000? The DWP are not so stupid as to over pay anybody £16000!

So how did it happen?

Have you been putting money away in the bank that amounted to savings over £6000 or £16000 and did not tell the DSS.

You also mention an inheritance.Is that what happened?

Did you inherit money that amounted to savings over £16000 and continued to claim income support without telling the DWP that you now have savings over £6000 and over £16000.

The rules and law of the DSS or DWP Social security clearly state that you must tell the DWP if your savings get to £5,500, but they do not reduce your income support until your savings reach £6000.
So any savings you have under £6000 is not effected in your income support or job seekers allowance, housing benifit or other means tested benefits.

But if you have £6000 and over then you must tell the DWP and they will take £1 off of your income support for every £250 over £6000. And if your saving reach £16000 then income support is stopped altogether until your savings go below £16000.

And if you have got savings over £6000 and over £16000 and you did not tell the DSS this,you have broken the law. And you can be taken to court and made to pay back any amount of money you were overpaid by the DSS by the court.You could also be sent to prison as it is benefit fraud. And the law takes a dim view of this. And even first offenders have been sent to prison.

But if it is you offer to pay it back as you say you have done.And it is your first offence.Then they will likely let you off of prison. On condition that you pay all the money that you owe money back to the DWP.

And if you cannot pay back the money all at one the court can arrange for you to pay it back in monthly instalments to the DWP.

You should get yourself a lawyer , that is a solicitor, as even if it is your first offence, you could still be sent to prison. It is benefit fraud.

If you had savings over £6000 and over £16000,you should have told the DWP this in the first place. As even if you do not tell them the DWP can check the banks if they suspect you have savings over £6000 and have not told them.Or if they think you are doing any paid work and claiming benefits,which is also legal.

So I hope you have learned your lesson.You now have to get legal help from a lawyer, solicitor, to represent you in court. Barbara.

chigley

I think the OP means they received an overpayment of Income Support of £16,000.00, not that they had over £16,000.00 in capital.

That said though, an overpayment of £16,000.00 is a lot of money, and of course, the fraud will have gone on for some time for such an amount to accrue, so it is therefore serious in the eyes of the Law.