Problem tenants not paying rent !!!!

Ulfar

By my reckoning your S21 is invalid as the 6 months fixed term does not expire on 11/02/2012 but 13/02/2012. Tenancy started 14/08/11 6 months ends 13/02/12, these technicalities do count.

Yorkie1

Ulfar wrote: »

By my reckoning your S21 is invalid as the 6 months fixed term does not expire on 11/02/2012 but 13/02/2012. Tenancy started 14/08/11 6 months ends 13/02/12, these technicalities do count.

OP has given different dates during this thread; an early post said the contract term was 14 Aug to 13 Feb; another (subsequent) post stated it was 12 Aug to 11 Feb.

Assuming the latter to be true, the s.21 is valid. Otherwise, not.

thegirlintheattic

bikingbarney wrote: »

ok here goes...........

6 month contract from 14th august to 13 feb

section 21 issued on the 11 dec to coincide with the end of contract.

so far they are a week and half late with rent this month

last month was 3 weeks

guarantor was contacted last month after no reply from tenants and his wife paid the rent by debit card

guarantor and tenant both ignoring the letting agents communication this month.

with regards to credit checks we were kept informed at the start as the lad had a ccj and was trying to pay it off, in the end the tenancy agreement went in the girls name even though she doesnt work and he was paying the rent with his father as the guarantor

apparently they have split up and he has moved out of the house .


hope this helps

You could have foreseen this happening with:
- One partner not working - the one who is responsible for rent
- One with CCJ (big red flag)

I would be checking the guarrentors agreement very carefully at this point, to make sure not little errors have occurred making it invalid. EDIT: If the guarrentor has not signed anything then the agreement is worth nought and you are relying on good will (or their poor understanding of the agreement) to pay.

When the S21 has expired (if served correctly) apply to the court for possession. I would also reply to the tenant saying that unfortunately her personal issues are not your problem, she is responsible for rent and must pay. Tell her to take her ex to small claims after she has paid you if she thinks she has a case.

BitterAndTwisted

OP can you PLEASE make up your mind as to who is named on the tenancy agreement and what the precise dates on it are. Given the problems and time-wasting you have already endured you do not want to get to court in March or April just to have your S21 thrown out and then you'll have to start all over gain. If you're unlucky you could still be trying to get shot of them in the summer.

Just join a landlords association and be done with it. Membership will provide all the guidance and hand-holding you may need through this process

bikingbarney

BitterAndTwisted wrote: »

OP can you PLEASE make up your mind as to who is named on the tenancy agreement and what the precise dates on it are. Given the problems and time-wasting you have already endured you do not want to get to court in March or April just to have your S21 thrown out and then you'll have to start all over gain. If you're unlucky you could still be trying to get shot of them in the summer.

Just join a landlords association and be done with it. Membership will provide all the guidance and hand-holding you may need through this process

Hi Folks

first of all my apologies over all the different dates given, Im very tired and stressed over the whole situation.

anyway just to clarify.

6 months AST dated 12 august 2011 - 11th february 2012

s21 dated to expire 11th ferbruary 2012


both names in section headed Names of tenants


further in to the tenancy agreement there is a page headed special or additional clauses


on this there is a heading Permitted occupier
which goes on to say this.... tenant x is permitted occupier of the property for the term of this tenancy under the permit care and control of the tenants. for the avoidance of doubt, the landlord does not recognise them as tenants.

Tenant x is the one who was paying the rent as tenant y, his partner does not work.

there is another section Guarantor

this gives the name of the guarantor (tenant x father ) and says they have agreed to act as guarantor of the this tenancy and to be responsible to the landlord for any loss,damage,costs or other expenses(including rent) arising out of the tenants breach of or failure to comply with the obligations and responsibilities of this agreement.


I have no signatures for the guarantor, I only hope that the letting agent does.

can anyone explain the permitted occupier bit to me as i do not fully understand it.

tenant x is the one who also had/has the ccj

GDB2222

Hopefully, your agents do have a valid, signed guarantee. Otherwise, you may have to consider taking legal action against the agents.

Your best hope here is to keep plugging away at the guarantors. Keep your fingers crossed that they have money. It will take a good 6 months to get the girl out of the flat if she chooses to be awkward. Round here (Barnet) there was a 2 to 3 months waiting list for the bailiffs last time I checked. That's after the court order has been issued, and you can only start applying for that in Feb-12.

debrag

bikingbarney wrote: »

This month I thought I would stay on top of it and surprise surprise they haven't paid again, whilst I was on the phone to the letting agent one of her colleagues got through to the tenant on the phone who said "oh well my boyfriend pays the rent and i thought he had paid it " and then she put the phone down.

bikingbarney wrote: »

apparently they have split up and he has moved out of the house .

hope this helps

So she thinks he's still paying when he's no-longer lives there? Ok I know he is still in the contract and should be paying but I can't see him doing so.

has she started a claim for LHA?

G_M

bikingbarney wrote: »

both names in section headed Names of tenants


further in to the tenancy agreement there is a page headed special or additional clauses


on this there is a heading Permitted occupier
which goes on to say this.... tenant x is permitted occupier of the property for the term of this tenancy under the permit care and control of the tenants. for the avoidance of doubt, the landlord does not recognise them as tenants.

Tenant x is the one who was paying the rent as tenant y, his partner does not work.

there is another section Guarantor

this gives the name of the guarantor (tenant x father ) and says they have agreed to act as guarantor of the this tenancy and to be responsible to the landlord for any loss,damage,costs or other expenses(including rent) arising out of the tenants breach of or failure to comply with the obligations and responsibilities of this agreement.


I have no signatures for the guarantor, I only hope that the letting agent does.

can anyone explain the permitted occupier bit to me as i do not fully understand it.

tenant x is the one who also had/has the ccj

1) how many 'tenants' are there? You seem to be saying now there are TWO named tenants, + a third person listed as 'Permitted Occupier' - is this correct? And if so, which one has moved out and which one is (supposedly) paying the rent

2) If the Guarantee clause in the tenancy is all there is, it is useless. IS THERE A SEPARATE DEED (it must be a deed) signed by the guarantor(s) - and witnessed - and did the gurantors have a copy of the tenancy given to them? If you don't know, find out.

3) the 'permitted occupier clause makes little sense if 'tenant x' is bot permitted occupier AND listed as one of the two tenants, but you don't make this clear. If 'tenant x' is NOT a tenant (JUST a permitted occupier) then you have no claim for anything against tenant x who does not have to pay you anything.

Please - stop being vague and give clear answers. Giving vague answers, and conflicting answers (eg dates) does not help us, and does not help you - in fact it is extremely frustrating as well as time-wasting.

bikingbarney

G_M wrote: »

1) how many 'tenants' are there? You seem to be saying now there are TWO named tenants, + a third person listed as 'Permitted Occupier' - is this correct? And if so, which one has moved out and which one is (supposedly) paying the rent

2) If the Guarantee clause in the tenancy is all there is, it is useless. IS THERE A SEPARATE DEED (it must be a deed) signed by the guarantor(s) - and witnessed - and did the gurantors have a copy of the tenancy given to them? If you don't know, find out.

3) the 'permitted occupier clause makes little sense if 'tenant x' is bot permitted occupier AND listed as one of the two tenants, but you don't make this clear. If 'tenant x' is NOT a tenant (JUST a permitted occupier) then you have no claim for anything against tenant x who does not have to pay you anything.

Please - stop being vague and give clear answers. Giving vague answers, and conflicting answers (eg dates) does not help us, and does not help you - in fact it is extremely frustrating as well as time-wasting.

G_M I am not being vague !!

what I have wrote is correct

I have 2 tenants :- tenant x... working male

tenant y... non working female

BOTH are listed as tenants on the tenancy agreement

tenant x is also listed as permitted occupier??

how can this be right ??

spoke to letting agent today, they have a seperate covenant/deed that the guarantor has signed.

hope this helps


EDIT s21 is only lists tenant y on it and not tenant x??

RAS

Oh Dear.

Re-issue the S21 in both names with the right termination date, before Christmas.