Anyone been to an IFA and not been advised to buy Unit Trusts?

darkpool

qpop wrote: »

The fact is, like most in the industry, who plan to remain past 2012, I've spent a lot of time and effort learning the mathematics behind investment risk. To be told by an idiot that advisers sell unit trusts when far better "advice" would be a small portfolio of blue chip shares borders on insulting. What has resulted isn't a debate, but an argument, which is both cyclic and pointless.

Were there an opportunity to debate the pro's and cons of individual sharedealing, tracker investing, closed vs open ended investment companies, etc, then I'd jump at the opportunity, as I have a lot to say, a lot to listen to, and a lot to learn, on the matters (as do we all).

it's an argument that the IFAs here seem loath to respond to though. What advantages does a UT have over a portfolio of well chosen shares? Perhaps you can get better diversification/ sector exposure, but is that worth 3% a year?

So what do you think the annual charges for holding a UT through an IFA is? Dunstonh said that it was nowhere near 3%, yet has not said how much it is.

Meeper

Fairleads - there is no point responding to you, as anything that we write will be labelled as "a red herring designed to put the blame onto the consumer". Ridiculous point of view.

Darkpool - The majority of my recent investments for clients have had a total cost of between 1.8% and 2.2% per annum. Not for a Unit Trust, but for a professionally managed portfolio of Unit Trusts and OEICs. The percentages quoted above cover the ongoing adviser servicing, discretionary management cost, platform charges and individual fund charges. There isn't anything else that I could add to the service to get it anywhere near to 3% as far as I can see.

darkpool

swiss69 wrote: »

A recommendation of a portfolio of blue chip shares in 2007 would have no doubt included Hbos, RBS, Lloyds and Barclays..........

A recommendation for commercial property in 2006 would see you looking at some big losses 5 years later......

You really think many of the big fund managers jumped out of the banks before the credit crisis? i would doubt it.

Commercial property offers some good investments now.....

darkpool

Meeper wrote: »

Darkpool - The majority of my recent investments for clients have had a total cost of between 1.8% and 2.2% per annum. Not for a Unit Trust, but for a professionally managed portfolio of Unit Trusts and OEICs. The percentages quoted above cover the ongoing adviser servicing, discretionary management cost, platform charges and individual fund charges. There isn't anything else that I could add to the service to get it anywhere near to 3% as far as I can see.

and how about the dealing costs in the funds? or does the tooth fairy pay for that?

even 2% seems a lot considering long term market growth of 5 - 7%. investors are losing a third of their returns in fees.

Meeper

darkpool wrote: »

You really think many of the big fund managers jumped out of the banks before the credit crisis? i would doubt it.

Exactly!

The people with qualifications in statistical analysis coming out of their ears couldn't predict any of it and move at the right time, so what makes you think you, or any other average man in the street, could do any better?

gadgetmind

I recently had an initial meeting with an IFA who said that no-one ever made money from equities before outlining his scheme for using SIPPs to provide a loan pool for property developers. He explained that he worked on a fee basis but also took both a cut of the initial investment and an annual percentage.

Does this answer the OP's question?

Meeper

darkpool wrote: »

even 2% seems a lot considering long term market growth of 5 - 7%. investors are losing a third of their returns in fees.

Good swerve there! Nice how you change your argument to counter when you are shown to be incorrect. Previously you stoically stood behind your 3% charges. I write that my charges (total) are 1.8% to 2.2% and suddenly THAT is high. You really need to go and think about the argument you are trying to make instead of sticking corks in your dam every time you spring a leak.

Meeper

gadgetmind wrote: »

I recently had an initial meeting with an IFA who said that no-one ever made money from equities before outlining his scheme for using SIPPs to provide a loan pool for property developers. He explained that he worked on a fee basis but also took both a cut of the initial investment and an annual percentage.

Does this answer the OP's question?

I suppose it does, in a roundabout way. Amusing.

darkpool

Meeper wrote: »

Exactly!

The people with qualifications in statistical analysis coming out of their ears couldn't predict any of it and move at the right time, so what makes you think you, or any other average man in the street, could do any better?

so you agree that the fund managers were fully invested in banks before the credit crunch, and people should pay 3% a year for that?

darkpool

Meeper wrote: »

Good swerve there! Nice how you change your argument to counter when you are shown to be incorrect. Previously you stoically stood behind your 3% charges. I write that my charges (total) are 1.8% to 2.2% and suddenly THAT is high. You really need to go and think about the argument you are trying to make instead of sticking corks in your dam every time you spring a leak.

i still think 3% is nearer the mark when you factor in dealing charges and stamp duty....