Garage cant fix car but still wants to charge for faulty parts......... Advice please

pcyam

Apologies for not giving detail information about the car.

Its 06 plate, Renault Clio, 1.5 DCi Diesel car. Done under 40,000 miles. Brought in Jan 2011 secondhand.

The garage I took the car to, said when they looked at the car, they thought it was #4injector that went, replaced it test drove it then car brokedown, #2 went. replaced it, test drove it and then more injectors went, so went to replace #3 and #1 injector. Replaced them and then the car still wouldnt run.

So they said that new injectors must have been faulty. They towed the car to renault to look at the injectors to prove they were faulty. Renault said yes they were faulty, replaced them and the same thing happened. They looked into the problem and the high pressure pump/diesel pump was causing all the injectors to go as there was metal swarf in the car and going into the injectors.

Now my garage are wanting payment for the injectors and labour, plus a part which renault have replaced (a pipe) and labour for Renault too. To get the car up and running I would need a new pressure/diesel pump, 4 replacement injectors (which are covered under the warranty-so wouldnt need to pay again), possible fuel tank and fuel lines.

Their arguement is that they had to replace all the injectors to know that there was swarf in the car. Without changing the injectors they would have never known. EVEN when I told them that injectors normally go in 2's (thank you to the MSE on a previous post), they said that they had to change the other injectors as that was the dilema!

I spoke to them today and told them exactly as advised what Consumer Direct had said Supply of Goods and Services Act 1982, and to put my car as it was previously, they are saying they are not able to reput my original injectors back as they have gone back to Renault, but I am able to have the current four injectors for them to be looked at by someone else! Also, I have a loan car from them and as I am disputing the bill they want their vehicle back asap!!

Hope that all makes sense.

Again, thank you for all the advice,

marlot

atrixblue.-MFR-. wrote: »

prepare to do battle, they cannot keep you car or refuse to hand it back turn up with a tow truck and the police and see who says you cant have it back.

Yes they can.

A garage that has repaired your car has what is known as a 'lien'.



This is the right to keep the car until payment has been made for the work done. If you remove your car from the garage without authorisation you risk not only civil proceedings but also (except in Scotland and Northern Ireland) criminal prosecution.


The only alternative open to you, apart from legal proceedings or leaving your car while any dispute is sorted out, is to pay the amount demanded, marking the invoice as 'paid under protest'.

http://www.theaa.com/motoring_advice/legal-advice/can-the-garage-retain-my-car.html

marlot

[FONT=Arial, Chicago]A bit more on liens ...

If you are in dispute and refuse to pay the price the garage is charging, the garage is entitled to exercise a lien over the car (this is a legal right to hold disputed goods until payment is made). In these circumstances, the only way you can recover possession of the car is to 'pay under protest' and to pursue your claim for reimbursement via a trade association, if the garage is a member of one, or in court. If paying under protest it is advisable to make this clear in writing (e.g. writing the phrase 'paid under protest' on the back of the cheque). [/FONT]

http://www.tradingstandards.gov.uk/cgi-bin/wirral/con1item.cgi?file=*ADV0046-1011.txt

marlot

So if you're not being fed a line, then metal swarf is into the fuel system. This really is bad news.

As to whether they can demand payment ... The test is whether the first garage have approached the task with reasonable care and skill. This starts to become a specialist area. The garage is not required to be an absolute expert. I'd have said replacing the first injector was definately a reasonable course of action. Probably the second one also.

After that it starts to get trickier. Was it reasonable for them to replace the other two without checking why the first ones failed?
At what point should they have given up and got a Renault dealer involved?
should they (and could they) have checked for swarf earlier?

Ultimately I think these questions can only be resolved by specialist advice and/or court.

Unfortunately you're in a tough position, sorry. They have your car and can refuse to release it unless you pay. If you pay under protest (as is your right), then you'll only get your money back via an arbitration scheme (if the garage is a member), or through the courts. Sorry.

pcyam

marlot wrote: »

[FONT=Arial, Chicago]A bit more on liens ...[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial, Chicago]If you are in dispute and refuse to pay the price the garage is charging, the garage is entitled to exercise a lien over the car (this is a legal right to hold disputed goods until payment is made). In these circumstances, the only way you can recover possession of the car is to 'pay under protest' and to pursue your claim for reimbursement via a trade association, if the garage is a member of one, or in court. If paying under protest it is advisable to make this clear in writing (e.g. writing the phrase 'paid under protest' on the back of the cheque). [/FONT]

http://www.tradingstandards.gov.uk/cgi-bin/wirral/con1item.cgi?file=*ADV0046-1011.txt

Marlot, Yes I read this on the internet and also Trading Standards also told me this today.

Yet, as they are asking for the loan car back because of the fact I spoke to Trading Standards, I am able to pursue them for financial loss as I need a car and will have to make other arrangements.

marlot

You have my sympathy. Its shocking just how quickly a huge bill can accumulate on a car once the fuel system gets involved. Hope you can reach an amicable resolution with the garage.

SteveJW

Yes they can.

A garage that has repaired your car has what is known as a 'lien'.

I agree on this, however when the OP took his car to a garage for repair, he has effectively entered in to a contract, offer, acceptance intention to create legal relationship etc. The garage then failed to repair the vehicle and took it to a third party who was remote to the original contract. The final garage has a contract with the original garage, not the OP, the original garage has no legal title to the vehicle, therefore a lien cannot exist for the final garage.

As to petrol in diesel vehicles, all diesel injection systems rely on the fuel to act as a lubricant for the injection components, petrol is not a very good lubricant for this purpose. In a modern high pressure system major damage can occur in a couple of minutes, usually evident by metal swarf in the system

Good luck with trading standards etc

atrixblue.-MFR-.

i undertood the lien part, but as the first garage had it towed there then renault not making any forwith communication to the OP, could they justify using lien? they were under instruction from the first garage to wich originally was a warranty issue now renault has added costs and works caried out that the OP didnt agree to.

if they granted parts and labour warranty to the garage they would have been paid out on cost of part and labour so shouldnt expect the OP to cough up cash aswell for the same thing.

if renault can prove theres metal swarf by supply of a tested sample of fuel, and as a result damaged the new injectors this would void their warranty and payment for new injectors would be correct if you gave permission for them to be changed. renault didnt keep you old injectors? why its common practice to keep them untill payment is made.

renault cant penalise you for contacting trading standards, you have a right to seek advice, contact trading standards again to tell them their revoking curtesy car because you contacted them.

have renault drained the tank? replaced the fuel filter? taken sample of the fuel?

its not good for any diesel engine to have petrol run through it, but desastrous damage is usually a result of driving long distance with it in there. petrol in a diesel will act as a cleaner drying up and removing lubracation on internal pump part, other parts and turbo.

1.5 DCI doesnt usually suffer with injector failure as a common problem, its the 1.9 and 2.0 that usually suffer that problem 1.5 has a different setup where as the 1.9 and 2.0 share the same injector family.

OP for peice of mind, have the turbo checked also.