Please ensure your electrics are up to date!!!!!!!!!

gromituk

You're missing out on the greater fire and shock protection that a modern system offers, yes.

baldelectrician

Mary_Hartnell wrote: »

A very informative post above.
I have what must be a TT system supplied by two "overhead" thick aluminium wires, which I share with one neighbour.
It dates back to the 1960's and is so simple that even I can understand it:
4 Fuses of the wire variety that vaporise if there is a short circuit.
A big brown sliding switch that describes itself as "Henley 60 amp earth leakage circuit breaker".

The latter gets temperamental if there is a fault developing (EG if the insulation of a lighting socket has been perished by the heat from the bulb) AND one time when the neighbour installed a compressor that caused electrical surges on our shared overhead wires.

These days the "cupboard in the garage wall" of modern houses seem to have as much wiring as the Star Ship Enterprise.

Am I missing out on something?

If your circuit breaker is old it is either :

A Current operated Earth Leakage Circuit Breaker (now called a RCD)
or
A VOLTAGE opeated Earth Leakage Circuit Breaker (these are not good and rely on the [earth] fault passing through the device (if the fault is passing through a person this device will not operate)

You can tell a Voltage Operated ELCB as it has earth wires connected to it - if in doubt get an electrician to look at it

A Voltage operated ELCB is as much use as a chocolate fire guard

Hope this is of some use

gromituk

It will be a voltage-operated ELCB: these seem to be standard in overhead wire-supplied premises and are connected to an earth rod. When my parents had major electrical work done they had RCDs fitted but the ELCB was left.

AdrianW2

I've got a little bewildered amongst the hyperbole and paranoia in this thread. There are many comments about stuff being illegal/unlawful/unsafe, some from Martin himself, and not too many facts.

I understand that any new work has to be Part P approved. Does this apply to repairs too (usually repairs don't require building regs. approval)?

Does existing wiring have be certified? Does existing wiring have to meet current standards?

For as long as I can remember wiring has to be "safe" to meet supply regulations, which has always been interpreted as meeting IEEE wiring regs, so I don't see that much has changed with the new law (apart from the expensive piece of paper).

mttylad

You can repair & replace without needing to inform your LABC.

you can replace light fittings, sockets etc easily enough, even cables if they are damaged.

Exsting wiring does not need to meet existing requirements, if it met the requirements that were in force when it was installed.

It is when major changes are done (such as a consumer unit being replaced) that it then needs bringing up to current requirements.

AFAIK Part P is supposed to be designed so as not to prevent DIY work, if you are competent enough to replace faulty stuff then there is very little to prevent you doing so.

mttylad

BTW if you want some facts.

Fact - Part P is not the law, part P is an approved document.
Fact - BS7671/IEE wiring regs is not the law, it is an approved way of doing electrical works.

Following the above though is considered being in accordance with the law.

zax47

AdrianW2 wrote: »

I've got a little bewildered amongst the hyperbole and paranoia in this thread. There are many comments about stuff being illegal/unlawful/unsafe, some from Martin himself, and not too many facts.

I understand that any new work has to be Part P approved. Does this apply to repairs too (usually repairs don't require building regs. approval)?

Does existing wiring have be certified? Does existing wiring have to meet current standards?

For as long as I can remember wiring has to be "safe" to meet supply regulations, which has always been interpreted as meeting IEEE wiring regs, so I don't see that much has changed with the new law (apart from the expensive piece of paper).

This (previously quoted) post at UltimateHandyMan is a good reference for dispelling the myths about Part P, the "law", and what you can/can't do for yourself, before you must call in a qualified electrician who is registered with a Part P scheme (like me!);

DIY Electrical work and Part P

Have a good read of it.

mttylad is quite right about the "legalities". Part P insists that the electrical design and installation shall meet defined standards for safety, by implication this means complying with BS7671:2008 IEE 17th Edition wiring regulations - which are guidelines for best practice. Neither of these are enshrined in statue law! The only statute law involved is The Electricity at Work Act - which applies to me as a tradesman, but not to you as a DIYer.

lisap4123

The experience of FTB worried has concerned me. My dad has been on at me to get the electrics sorted in my house. My Ex's uncle (who has his own building company) a few years ago did out the cellar for us into a proper room, damp proof membrane with concrete floor and put in 2 plug sockets above the skirting board. A few days after the work was finished there was some bad weather and the cellar flooded up to about 3" of water - it stopped rising just before the top of the sockets. It was awful that the hard work was ruined a few days after it was completed. The cellar dried out ane the plugs worked fine, but that was a good few years ago now. The cellar is just a storage room now with a concrete floor. Then in 2007 it flooded again. Again it stopped just before the top of the skirting just missing the sockets. Again it dried out and the sockets were fine. When it floods I sleep with the main consumer unit turned off just in case. But my dad is concerned and thinks the plus sockets should be moved up the wall just in case it floods unexpectadly when I am not in ( the water can rise quickly).

So last year I got an electrician in to quote me for moving the sockets up the wall. He said that he couldnt just do it like that and that I needed a more up to date consumer unit and the second of the 2 RCD cut offs wasnt working?? However he said he couldnt in a new CU as he couldnt see an earth to the electricity or gas meter. I live in a 100+ year old terrace. I believe that there is a grounded earth which isnt visible. The electrician thought this may be the case but said I still needed for 1 of the meters to be earthed properly which he could get done for £50, and then he could update the consumer unit. But then I found out that only certain registered electicians can replace consumer units and give a certificate which would be needed if I came to sell the house. The electrician wasnt a registered one for certificating so I got another quote.

The 2nd electrician said that I did need a new consumer unit but that the new consumer units were more sensitive than the older ones and when the wiring was attached to the new one it would show up any faults, which worst case scenario would mean my whole house being re-wired...a few thousand.....which I just cannot afford.

So what started with moving 2 sockets for safety has ended up in needing possibly a spare few thousand for re-wiring the house. I am worried but what can I do - I cant afford that right now. Does all of this sound right? I know I can get some impartial sensible advice from fellow MSE's

gromituk

Regardless of the socket situation, I would consider installing a pump to remove the water. You will need to dig a sump big enough for the pump and deep enough for it to be immersed enough for its float switch to operate before it is full. You'll then need to run its outlet tube up to the nearest drain. Pumps for this application are quite cheap - £30 or so - and have a 10m mains lead that you can plug in upstairs.

AdrianW2

lisap4123 wrote: »

The 2nd electrician said that I did need a new consumer unit but that the new consumer units were more sensitive than the older ones and when the wiring was attached to the new one it would show up any faults, which worst case scenario would mean my whole house being re-wired...a few thousand.....which I just cannot afford.

Perhaps someone more knowledgeable than me can explain why a new CU should be needed just to relocate a cable?

You've already got RCDs that aren't tripping, so the existing wiring can't be that bad.

lisap4123 wrote: »

So what started with moving 2 sockets for safety has ended up in needing possibly a spare few thousand for re-wiring the house.

That's the mess that the electrical industry has created. In order to solve a 1 in 10,000,000 problem they've discouraged people from fixing real issues.