E.ON press the re-set button

quietheart

E.ON_Company_Representative:_Helena wrote: »

Hi quietheart,

I am sorry that you feel the need to find a new provider.

I understand your frustrations and changing tariff and Direct Debit amounts go hand in hand.

It sounds like you have come off a cheaper tariff and the Direct Debit hasn't reflected the new tariff, so leaving you with a debt.

Things can be done to help situations like these, you can change to your preferred tariff when your contract runs out and then ask us to do a calculation of the Direct Debit so this fits better with your new prices. This should help things run more smoothly on your account.

If you like my specific help, I will be more than happy to look in to your account for you.

You can email your details to the email address in my profile page.

Helena

Thanks Helena,
I have just emailed you.

meggsy

DirectDebacle wrote: »

Here's a suggestion.

Align everyone to achieve a zero balance on the 12th consecutive DD payment following their signup date.

Those two lines sum it up DD !! :mad:

Only two lines from CF so far ...
http://www.consumerfocus.org.uk/news/e-ons-announcement-of-improvements-to-its-direct-debit-policy

backfoot

http://twitpic.com/6zqgc2/full

This was the Eon explanation of their DD policy from a post made on 17/10/2011.

Post 96 of this thread.(well worth a reread of this thread)

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/3531893

The table shows, that depending on when you join Eon, will determine the recovery period up to 17 months maximum.

A different recovery period depending on start date in order to acheive Eon's cash flow manipulation still remains and discriminates unfairly for different customers within Eon and by comparison with other Suppliers.

The table itself illustrated the impact on DD values based on the contract starting point. Added to that, the effect of massive price hikes had caused DD increases of up to 60% in some cases. It is also worth mentioning that the table did not portray a typical gas/electricity split to understate the impact.

So I look forward to Eon's response as to how today's Press Announcement differs from what was the existing policy before?

I hope I am missing something because a lot of Press Coverage has already been given to this, including Consumer Focus comment.

DirectDebacle

backfoot wrote: »

http://twitpic.com/6zqgc2/full


I hope I am missing something because a lot of Press Coverage has already been given to this, including Consumer Focus comment.

I don't think you are missing anything because other than the press release there is no detail of how they have addressed the original problem. It appears they have now stopped serving the dogs breakfast and the dogs dinner is now on the menu.

This change was allegedly made on 16/1/12. That being the case I would expect,

The methodology to be in place.

Customer notification and explanation to at least be in the post by now.

Their website DD information updated.

Possibly a revised Twitter Table. (Why are April and May not shown as 12 months to Spring Review)

An MSE rep briefed, ready, willing and able to answer questions raised. After all this thread was started by E.On in order to promote their companies policies.

I noticed that the website does state E.On DD discount is not given for simply by paying by DD (as all other suppliers) but for this reason.

Why do I have a credit or debit balance?

Your account should always be in credit as you pay for your energy before you use it. This is why we give you a discount for paying this way.

At the moment it appears little has changed. The most important change they should make is to the misleading way they present their DD scheme to customers and potential customers. If it were made transparent then I believe the drop off in new customers would be sufficient to persuade them to make a real change to their policy.

(If, as E.On believe, it is such a good idea why are they not advertising its' benefits and stealing other suppliers customers because of it.)

For that reason they won't be decent, honest and truthful in respect of their DD scheme. Complaints will continue and so will the pressure on them from MSE and others.

So I look forward to Eon's response as to how today's Press Announcement differs from what was the existing policy before?

So do I but explanations from them are not a strong point. Maybe a Reset Review could look at that aspect too.

backfoot

Helena has posted several times this morning so it appears she has been briefed not to respond to MSE posters or specific posters on their 'new' DD policy.

Something that is of high importance to Eon such as their first 'Reset' you would think would demand good PR and support. The message is important as like any policy the devil is in the detail.

After receiving such attention,principally from MSE, then later Consumer Focus and more latterly Ofgem, then you you would have thought the management of the objectors and interested parties would have been a key strategy.

I personally would have liked to have said 'we won, we got them to change' and we could all of moved with a win/win for both sides.

The simple solution as DD has said many times would have been to normalise to a 1/12th scheme but to offer an alternative.Instead we are being told of a change of approach.

Those people who have carefully studied this in detail are still confused because it still looks like the majority of new starter customers would be hit by a short year recovery of annual charges. The apparent concession sounds good at first glance (but in practice because of the 3 month spring definition), it means that 15 months charges including two winter peak periods get recoved over this period.(unless we have missed the point).

Furthermore, Eon went specifically out their way to state back in October 2011, that late year starters already had their charges 'zero balanced' over 12 months plus a few more. The Twitter table actually illustrated it.

Can Eon have overlooked all this? It seems incredible to me that they thought this wouldn't be noticed. Although CF have obviously been initially fooled.

So Helena (Eon) :

Please have the courtesy to answer :

What is the difference between the new announcement and the previous policy?

Are you still in dialogue with MSE posters regarding the detail of your DD policy?

jalexa

backfoot wrote: »

Those people who have carefully studied this in detail are still confused because it still looks like the majority of new starter customers would be hit by a short year recovery of annual charges....

Indeed, but the issue of the "sudden excessive hike" syndrome is not addressed at all by the 16 January change as announced and affects all customers not just new (short-year) customers. That is because the calculation depends on the period between the date of the "interim review" (whether scheduled or the result of a meter reading) and the fixed "annual review" date.

To avoid "sudden excessive hike" the process needs to be a 12 month rolling calculation.

You mention "CF have obviously been initially fooled". Has CF updated their gushing press release or do they remain "fooled"?

DirectDebacle

Can an E.On rep confirm if the following features of their previous spring balance policy are unchanged by the review.

1. It remains merely a policy/practice and has not become a Term and Condition of the contract.

2. On joining E.On the initial DD is set on the basis of cost of annual usage/12 = monthly DD.

3. Prior to entering into the contract (and on subsequent re-assessment) a detailed explanation of the DD scheme and how the spring balance policy has affected any change is not given.

4. Customers who do not agree with the policy and wish to keep their DD payments set to the basis they were originally agreed will be refused this right.

5. E.On will transfer such customers to other payment plans or cancel the contract if DD is the only payment option.

6. The revised DD scheme will still cause some customers to pay a monthly DD in excess of that which would be paid using the original 12 month DD scheme.

7. E.On are in breach of contract by enforcing upon customers a policy which does not form part of the agreed Terms and Conditions of the contract.

If any of the above has been changed please explain what the changes are and how they will impact upon your customers.

backfoot

It looks like Eon will not now respond to the ongoing concerns and honest questions being asked by Posters who have followed and understand this issue. I know from personal dialogue with other posters that we have only genuinely tried to reflect the views of many posters on this and other forums.There is no other agenda.

From a personal point of view, I would also love to be an Eon customer but because I am aware of this unfair system I am restricted on Supplier choice. The intention of working so hard on this was to help other customers and to allow Eon to gain and retain Customers, including me. In a nutshell ,their own Reset Campaign.

It appears,unless we have missed something,that a tactical ploy has been used by Eon to , at best, marginally tinker with the recovery period (possibly one more month). This has been sold as a significant alteration to their scheme and policy!

Eon are invited to answer these points including the important implementation questions asked by DirectDebacle.

The absence of any sort of response so far,indicates that they don't have any real answer and the policy remains very confusing.

Eon like to rely on their 'Your Say' panel and survey customers with question led responses. That is fair enough and it is important, but is it as constructive and detailed as has been shown by the MSE real experiences and the analysis of some of the knowledgeable posters?

DD, it might be worth copying your questions across to the Consumer Focus thread. I know Ofgem are looking at that as well as CF.

Both parties may then see that there are significant ongoing concerns which may not be apparent on first viewing.I would like to think that CF/Ofgem had the same level of understanding as we share, as they evaluate the Regulation of Direct Debits. CF initial response yesterday shows they may not have properly understood the Announcement.

jalexa

DirectDebacle wrote: »

2. On joining E.On the initial DD is set on the basis of cost of annual usage/12 = monthly DD.

Don't want do detract from the impact of your excellent post but point 2 is I think important. I cannot speak for current E.ON practice but on every switch I have made (that's "many", including at least once to E.ON) the initial DD has been set from information entered into the comparison website. It is (I believe) implicit that on a Consumer Focus accredited comparison the default comparison period is 12 months. I completely agree with your "contractually" based arguments and references to "12 months".

If I am right that initial consumption is "self certified" by the customer then I think the Consumer Focus accreditation is fundamentally flawed.

I see two possible solutions, calculation periods (for 12 month comparisons) should be mandated to be a "rolling 12 months" or comparisons need to be based on actual consumption - as held by the industry - for the premises. Harder but not impossible.

It cannot be right that customers accept a (12 month) comparison based on information provided in good faith only to be subjected to "sudden excessive hike" syndrome at the first recalculation.

Regarding E.ON reps "silence", they have a *relatively*:D good record on forum engagemement, something I respect. I could well understand if circumspection has been instructed.

OTOH, I have little regard for the Consumer Focus reps absence from forum engagement.

DirectDebacle

I agree that comparison sites are going to have difficulty factoring in suppliers differing policies and applying the effect on the usage input by the user. Another example was the problem for low users switching to npower. The seasonally weighted Tier 1 units caused higher than expected charges for them and wasn't picked up by comparison sites.

Comparison sites will only be accurate if they are comparing like for like and sometimes this isn't the case.

The problem with E.On at the moment is that in effect they are keeping their policy 'secret'. A potential switcher to E.On, even if they didn't 'click through' from the comparison site but instead went to the E.On site or phoned customer sales would have to work very hard to discover how E.On manage DD payments.

You make a good point and comparison sites would be worthy of a dedicated thread. The Govt, MSE and the comparison sites themselves are heavily pushed at consumers to compare, save and switch. That is what many do and sometimes regret it. There should be more guidance on the use of comparison sites.

I use them as a filtering tool to reduce the hundreds of choices of tariff down to 2 or 3 then scrutinise the fine print on the suppliers website. TBH, even doing that, I would still probably have been caught out by E.Ons policy had I switched to them.