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Closure of O2 account - without warning!
br1anstorm
Posts: 215 Forumite
in Mobiles
We have (or had) a "spare" mobile phone with an O2 pay-as-you-go account on which we had stored about £10 of credit. As this was an emergency phone, for use if or when our normal mobiles were unavailable, we used it only rarely.
We were aware that if we failed to do so for some months the number might be suspended. That's what has happened. So I called O2 to ask them to reactivate the number and advise how much credit was still in the PAYG account. To my surprise, O2 said that they could not reactivate the number: they had no trace of it, so it must have been permanently disconnected...... and they could not tell me how much credit might have been on the account (so certainly could not refund it!).
Now I accept that O2 and other companies don't want to maintain hundreds of phone numbers that are used infrequently or not at all. So it's fair that they should suspend little-used accounts. But if they are going to disconnect permanently, surely they should at least notify the subscriber first?
As I said to the O2 customer service lady - people would be outraged if a bank closed your account, and kept all the money in it, without letting you know, simply because you hadn't written a cheque for a few months!
DO other mobile phone companies have a similar policy? Does Ofcom have a view on this? At the least it is sharp practice and very customer-unfriendly. Some might call it theft.
We were aware that if we failed to do so for some months the number might be suspended. That's what has happened. So I called O2 to ask them to reactivate the number and advise how much credit was still in the PAYG account. To my surprise, O2 said that they could not reactivate the number: they had no trace of it, so it must have been permanently disconnected...... and they could not tell me how much credit might have been on the account (so certainly could not refund it!).
Now I accept that O2 and other companies don't want to maintain hundreds of phone numbers that are used infrequently or not at all. So it's fair that they should suspend little-used accounts. But if they are going to disconnect permanently, surely they should at least notify the subscriber first?
As I said to the O2 customer service lady - people would be outraged if a bank closed your account, and kept all the money in it, without letting you know, simply because you hadn't written a cheque for a few months!
DO other mobile phone companies have a similar policy? Does Ofcom have a view on this? At the least it is sharp practice and very customer-unfriendly. Some might call it theft.
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How are they supposed to do this if the the sim that has not been used for 6 months is more than likely to be in a switched off phone or in a drawer in the best case scenario?br1anstorm wrote: »We have (or had) a "spare" mobile phone with an O2 pay-as-you-go account on which we had stored about £10 of credit. As this was an emergency phone, for use if or when our normal mobiles were unavailable, we used it only rarely.
We were aware that if we failed to do so for some months the number might be suspended. That's what has happened. So I called O2 to ask them to reactivate the number and advise how much credit was still in the PAYG account. To my surprise, O2 said that they could not reactivate the number: they had no trace of it, so it must have been permanently disconnected...... and they could not tell me how much credit might have been on the account (so certainly could not refund it!).
Now I accept that O2 and other companies don't want to maintain hundreds of phone numbers that are used infrequently or not at all. So it's fair that they should suspend little-used accounts. But if they are going to disconnect permanently, surely they should at least notify the subscriber first?
It is a surprise only to those who don't read the T&C and prefer making groundless assumptions instead.
Pay & Go service terms after June 2008Our Rights to Bar or Disconnect Your Mobile Phone
7.1 If you do not make or receive a chargeable call at least once in any 6 month period your Mobile Phone will be disconnected and you will lose any remaining credits balance on your Account. If you wish to be re-connected after this time you will be given a new Mobile Phone number.
Yes. Even worse, it is 3 months for some providers.DO other mobile phone companies have a similar policy?0 -
Its in the T&C's of all the network, so it can't be called theft.
Yes, all network do it. The number can be reconnected if the customer calls in within a certain time of the disconnection (different for each network) , but after that the number lost for good. The payg acc is closed and any credit is lost (again, in the T&C's).
If you only switch the phone on to use it every few months, how are they going to let you know? The systems automated anyway based on time without use. . .0 -
Thanks to both grumbler and jon... Both quite right to point me in the direction of the Ts&Cs. Problem was - or is - that I'm finding it quite hard to discover and compare the policy and time limits of the various different providers. I did look on the 02 website, but couldn't find the para now quoted above...
Some cover it in FAQs, but for other providers (especially where they offer a multitude of different types of account) it is often hard to track down which Ts&Cs apply to which accounts!
Just as an illustration, it seems that Ikea Family do send an alert before suspending an account (according to their FAQs). But - for example - what is Virgin's cutoff, three months or six? And Tesco Lite?
The point about not sending a reminder alert because the phone might be in a drawer is hardly an excuse not to do so. A text would flash up as soon as the phone was switched on, whether or not this was to make a call.
As for the matter of un-used credit, theft may be a strong word. But think about it. Banks may close an inactive account: but they don't confiscate the money left in it, and the account-holder (or in some cases the heirs!) can still recoup the money. Why should phone companies not play by the same rules?0 -
Three.br1anstorm wrote: »But - for example - what is Virgin's cutoff, three months or six?
http://www.virginmobile.com/vm/home.do >> The legal stuff >> Ctrl+F >> 'chargeable'
It would flash only if the phone was switched on before disconnection.The point about not sending a reminder alert because the phone might be in a drawer is hardly an excuse not to do so. A text would flash up as soon as the phone was switched on, whether or not this was to make a call.0 -
br1anstorm wrote: »Thanks to both grumbler and jon... Both quite right to point me in the direction of the Ts&Cs. Problem was - or is - that I'm finding it quite hard to discover and compare the policy and time limits of the various different providers. I did look on the 02 website, but couldn't find the para now quoted above...
Some cover it in FAQs, but for other providers (especially where they offer a multitude of different types of account) it is often hard to track down which Ts&Cs apply to which accounts!
Just as an illustration, it seems that Ikea Family do send an alert before suspending an account (according to their FAQs). But - for example - what is Virgin's cutoff, three months or six? And Tesco Lite?
The point about not sending a reminder alert because the phone might be in a drawer is hardly an excuse not to do so. A text would flash up as soon as the phone was switched on, whether or not this was to make a call.
As for the matter of un-used credit, theft may be a strong word. But think about it. Banks may close an inactive account: but they don't confiscate the money left in it, and the account-holder (or in some cases the heirs!) can still recoup the money. Why should phone companies not play by the same rules?
You've made another couple of incorrect assumptions there. Most importantly, text messages are valid for a maximum of one week. So sending a message to a phone that isn't in use is very unlikely to be read.
Secondly, when you top up a phone you are buying airtime credit. In a similair way that you buy a gift voucher and, like a gift voucher they are not exchangeable for cash or refundable and have expiry dates.0 -
.... It would flash only if the phone was switched on before disconnection.
Quite so. But our spare phone is usually sitting - switched on and plugged into its charger - either somewhere in the house, or on occasions in the car. So an alert would indeed alert us.
Yes, I know we could make a gratuitous call if we remembered and feared that suspension was imminent. Doesn't change the fact that the provider is the one taking the initiative to suspend; so the onus should be just as much on them to notify, as on the subscriber to remember to make a token call.
No real need for others to comment further: I think I now have a clearer picture of the way the phone companies approach this. Thanks to all who responded.0 -
Just because something is buried in an interminable T & C document, in minute type, does not make it either fair or reasonable.0
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Just because something is buried in an interminable T & C document, in minute type, does not make it either fair or reasonable.
It isn't buried though, neither the copy supplied with the handset or on the O2 website is in small print, indeed the booklet has it in bold.
People's views about what is and isn't reasonable will vary, I don't think its unreasonable to expect one call or text in a six month period.
What do you think would be a reasonable time before its assumed the account is unused? Bearing in mind there is a small cost involved in operating the account (administration + use of the control channels etc)0 -
It isn't buried though, neither the copy supplied with the handset or on the O2 website is in small print, indeed the booklet has it in bold.
People's views about what is and isn't reasonable will vary, I don't think its unreasonable to expect one call or text in a six month period.
What do you think would be a reasonable time before its assumed the account is unused? Bearing in mind there is a small cost involved in operating the account (administration + use of the control channels etc)
I have recently been playing 'service provider roulette', switching between the three main companies in an attempt to find one capable of providing a reliable signal where I live (rural, but in SE England). I can't say I have seen this condition in any of the companies' literature - though I am vaguely aware of it.
I am neither blind, nor partially sighted.
Frankly, it wouldn't surprise me if buried within the acres of BS that accompany a phone contract, that the company has a 'right' to claim the blood of your first born, under the right conditions.
In common with other corporate robbers (insurance and software companies spring to mind) mobile phone providers, running an increasingly cosy non-competing cartel, can do whatever they like - including providing a lousy service which mysteriously seems to slip through the sales of goods act - and get away with it.
Your mileage may vary.0 -
Well, the only PAYG brochure I have ATM is Lebara's. It's just 4 pages 3.5'x3.5' and obviously includes only the most essential information. However, they found place for this statement:I have recently been playing 'service provider roulette', switching between the three main companies in an attempt to find one capable of providing a reliable signal where I live (rural, but in SE England). I can't say I have seen this condition in any of the companies' literature - though I am vaguely aware of it.
I am neither blind, nor partially sighted.
I am pretty sure that all PAYG brochures that I've seen in my life had some similar warning.If you have not made a chargeable call within 80 days we will disconnect your Lebara Mobile SIM card0
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