MSE News: Confusion reigns as student fees fear takes hold

Lokolo

gadgetmind wrote: »

Why are you assuming that 9% of all earnings above a figure that's less than the UK average is small? Some people work hard for degrees that will put them on high starting salaries and a high escalator afterwards. Advising such people to take the expensive loan and sod the consequences wouldn't be helpful.

The loan is hardly expensive. On 30k a year you wil be paying back 810 a year. It will have very little effect on your budgets.

To payback just 65-70 a month to go to university for 3 years is hardly the most exensve decision to make. I do not understand why people still look at the headline debt and get scared, the 99% wont fully pay it back so why dont people just look at it as a tax?

The fact is the older loans are worse in terms of repayment which is the biggest factor of the loans, the headline debt is largely insignificant.

anselld

gadgetmind wrote: »

Yes, that bugs me too.

Students: "This stinks!"
HMG: "That's because you don't understand it. Here, let us explain ..."
Students: "Yes, got it first time, and this is really stinking the country up with a stinky stink."
HMG: "That's because you don't understand it. Here, let us explain ..."
Students: "Hello? Is there a human we can speak to about this?"
HMG: "That's because you don't understand it. Here, let us explain ..."

...

MSE Martin: The Government has failed to explain. Let me explain it some more ....

gadgetmind

Lokolo wrote: »

99% wont fully pay it back so why dont people just look at it as a tax?

Yup, so higher rate tax goes up to 49% (plus 2% NI) and top rate to 59%. Can the UK really retain the brightest and the best with tax rates that high coupled to interest rates designed to burden them with this for 30 years?

We're really struggling to recruit right now, but do manage to get bright young things from Greece, Spain, etc. Over the next few years, I expect our "foreign intake" to increase and our UK intake to dwindle. We're failing our young, particularly the best of the best.

gadgetmind

anselld wrote: »

MSE Martin: The Government has failed to explain. Let me explain it some more ....

Well quite. How many shouty headlines has he extracted from this?

lynzpower

gadgetmind wrote: »

Well quite. How many shouty headlines has he extracted from this?

You dont understand

Let me explain

If you never earn 21k

21k? but thats really low

No you dont understand

etc etc

anselld

gadgetmind wrote: »

Well quite. How many shouty headlines has he extracted from this?

Not to mention leading the Student Finance Task Force for Two-brains Willetts!

Lokolo

gadgetmind wrote: »

Yup, so higher rate tax goes up to 49% (plus 2% NI) and top rate to 59%. Can the UK really retain the brightest and the best with tax rates that high coupled to interest rates designed to burden them with this for 30 years?

We're really struggling to recruit right now, but do manage to get bright young things from Greece, Spain, etc. Over the next few years, I expect our "foreign intake" to increase and our UK intake to dwindle. We're failing our young, particularly the best of the best.

So you're saying don't tax the highest earning any more?

Wow, so what's with all the protests at St. Pauls?

First people want richer people to pay more tax, now they don't if they have student debt. Surely no win situation?

Where is the government going to get the money to continue funding university education with numbers increasing year after year? Oh I suppose they could borrow... oh wait....

I also find it laughable that you are finding it hard to recruit, when unemployment is quite high. You aren't struggling to recruit, you are struggling to recruit high enough calibre students - which is nothing to do with how much university costs.

lynzpower

anselld wrote: »

Not to mention leading the Student Finance Task Force for Two-brains Willetts!

the left one doesn't know what the right one is doing

lynzpower

Lokolo wrote: »

So you're saying don't tax the highest earning any more?

Wow, so what's with all the protests at St. Pauls?

First people want richer people to pay more tax, now they don't if they have student debt. Surely no win situation?

Where is the government going to get the money to continue funding university education with numbers increasing year after year? Oh I suppose they could borrow... oh wait....

What the most obvious thing to do was to basically tell universities they cant accept those with lower A levels, after all part of the alleged problem is that a degree is not exclusive enough. It wouldn't need to be increasing number.

If you had to get minimum 3bs, or hell 3As to get into Uni -anywhere- then

a) less people would go= making degrees more exclusive and a real 'mark' of intelligence of the academic elite.
b) more people would be working (cos they are not in uni) so there would be more tax take.
c) Some universities would have to close down ( the crap ones)
d) the strong departments in weak unis could be merged with stronger unis or a cobbling together of the strengths from all over

There are all sorts of permutations,but ramping up the interest, increasing the amount borrowed and extending the period grads dont pay it back : with no discernible difference in the product is not a gift.


I dont know why Martin is so for it= makes pretty !!!! financial sense to me. :eek::eek::eek:

I also dont know why everyone is so fixated on 21grand as if its megamoney!! It so isnt :rotfl::rotfl: I hope we are all aspiring to earn more than a 3GCSE receptionist as thats what they get paid around here.

Cant he do an article on where we can go to get a degree thats a lot cheaper than this crock of... ?

gadgetmind

Lokolo wrote: »

So you're saying don't tax the highest earning any more?

Yes.

Wow, so what's with all the protests at St. Pauls?

First people want richer people to pay more tax, now they don't if they have student debt. Surely no win situation?

UK taxation needs to be competitive on an international basis. Currently it isn't and the trend is toward less competitive.

I also find it laughable that you are finding it hard to recruit, when unemployment is quite high. You aren't struggling to recruit, you are struggling to recruit high enough calibre students - which is nothing to do with how much university costs.

Yes, you're right, and I'm not laughing. Our rush to the mediocre regards higher education has given everyone a degree but no-one with anything of value. Employers don't trust degrees and have to have their own tests and training programmes, so what are universities bringing to the party?

I have recently encountered some *very* bright work experience students (age 16/17, send good letters to get work experience while at school we turn down 95%, but the other 5% ...). I am tempted to float the idea of an apprentice programme to run alongside our graduate programme.