Long term insomnia, is there anything that can be done?

jenniewb

Alybea wrote: »

Have you tried an eyemask? Like the ones you get on planes?
Blackout curtains for your head - but much cheaper.

There seems to be lots of over lapping issues - anxiety, eating disorder which are affecting your sleep. Have you spoken to your dietician about your insomnia, could they refer you to a sleep clinic?

I have an eye mask someone bought me which is made by Holistic Silk (apparently very expensive), it presses on my eye lids and I either wake up with a headache or find its even harder to fall asleep, plus it yanks on my hair with the tie at the back. I'm not sure if the plane versions are any different as I've never flown before.

With the black-out curtains, I have 5 large windows, they each spread wider then I can reach and are taller then I am and line my entire wall, I can't escape from the light they bring in! I did get a quote for blackout curtains and found that 7 years ago it was £300. I did check Ikea and it would work out to be £250 so not that much cheaper. I wish I had that type of money but being that I have had blackout curtains before I know they wouldn't stope the sleeplessness so although I'd love a set (or 5!) I'm not saving for them.

I did see my GP about the lack of sleep and am forever complaining about it when I see them (hence being on the "only for a short time" pills to knock me out. -I'm running veeeery low, hence my post!).
I was referred to a specalist who did a few basic tests (can you walk in a straight line, can you see straight, can you hear...etc) before telling me it was all lifestyle based (despite me saying I didn't go out to pubs and clubs) and that I should retire to bed by 8pm (so before I get home then!) and be up by 6pm and it would all fix itself. Was not offered a sleep clinic but he did suggest taking melatonine.

I spoke to my GP about melatonine and the specialist had said he was not able to prescribe it, only my GP was but my GP said it wasn't in the book so couldn't prescribe it. I looked in all the health food shops I knew and couldn't see it so google searched it only to find it was apparently banned in the UK.

Now I hear of so many others taking it I may look into it again but did see a site last night on foods which are high in melatonine and I eat most of them in rather large quantities each night anyway! (fresh fruit, tomatos-odd I know but I like them and can easily devour boxes of them! and lean white meat like chicken or turkey occasionally things like prawns and white fish- all of which are high in melatonine. Odd!)

I do and don't still get tierd: tonight I feel shattered, yesterday I felt I could run a marathon at 2am yet each night its still hard or impossible to fall asleep unless I am very very careful or take pills. On nights I don't take pills, I simply wont sleep (it never used to be like that so I think I am now dependant on the pills). I had my GP say just take them every other night but this just means I don't sleep every other night and with the additional physical health issues I already have its not something I really want to be doing 3-4 days a week! Maybe I need a second opinion on that!!

newmumincov

A few other suggestions for relaxation/sleep problems that I have personally tried and found helpful

TRE (Tension/Trauma Resease Exercises) - I find I sleep like a baby when i do these, ought to get back into this
http://traumaprevention.com/2009/12/31/what-is-tre/ (there's a book on amazon which I discovered when I was trying to resolve tension related neck/back pain)


Tai Chi - I went to classes a few years back and only stopped when I had to work 2nd shift. I did find it helpful.

Psychaley

I have insomnia, it's nothing to do with stress/anxiety etc I just can't sleep before 5am (was really useful whilst I was at university...not so much now)
I went to the doctors and he gave me tablets called Atarax (Hydroxyzine).
He gave me these as he didn't want me on anything I could get addicted to (they're an antihistamine and you can't get dependent on them),I've been reading the leaflet that came with them and they're actually used to treat anxiety too. I take one or two at night (though I've only been taking them when I have an early start the next day) and they usually start to work half and hour later. They definately make me feel totally relaxed.

He also printed off a huge booklet about getting into a good bed time routine and ways of reducing stress. I used to do all the steps that they suggest such as having a warm bath, listening to soft music etc which worked for awhile but now don't have any effect.

I was talking to a police officer one day last week who said he also had insomnia and had a machine that helped him sleep. I was intrigued but he didn't have time to explain what it was as he had another call to get to.

jenniewb

Psychaley wrote: »

I have insomnia, it's nothing to do with stress/anxiety etc I just can't sleep before 5am (was really useful whilst I was at university...not so much now)
I went to the doctors and he gave me tablets called Atarax (Hydroxyzine).
He gave me these as he didn't want me on anything I could get addicted to (they're an antihistamine and you can't get dependent on them),I've been reading the leaflet that came with them and they're actually used to treat anxiety too. I take one or two at night (though I've only been taking them when I have an early start the next day) and they usually start to work half and hour later. They definately make me feel totally relaxed.

He also printed off a huge booklet about getting into a good bed time routine and ways of reducing stress. I used to do all the steps that they suggest such as having a warm bath, listening to soft music etc which worked for awhile but now don't have any effect.

I was talking to a police officer one day last week who said he also had insomnia and had a machine that helped him sleep. I was intrigued but he didn't have time to explain what it was as he had another call to get to.

Thanks for that I was offered in the past an antihystamine pill which caused drowsiness, unfortunetly I waas getting side effects (said doctor) as I was barely able to keep my eyes open the rest of the day, would fall asleep on buses and just felt like I had a heavy cold all the time! I reduced the dose to half the tablet and it made very little difference- I still felt rubbish, like someone had zapped all the life out of me and my muscles were just so achey. I don't know if I was on the same as you are so I will ask my doctor about that (hoping for an appointment on monday).

I found the pill I take (have just run out of) works because I don't get the grogginess the next day. It can build up in my body though and every now and then I need to hold off on a dose (even though I half the smallest does I still depend on it and it still seems to build up). It was suggested to me by a doctor that I have an overly sensitive body as I seem to get side effects with most things I take!

I wish I could say mine wasn't to do with anxiety...but I'd be pretending otherwise to myself. I can feel like I really need to sleep, everything feels so tierd and like I just need to lie/sit down a minute to catch my breath type feeling (you know the feeling!) as my body is tierd. But then my mind starts racing. Its like the second I have nothing else occupying my brain something else steps in and I get swallowed up in the smallest thing and really wind myself up about it. I've gone through stages where I am worried someone has died, felt terrified I had some kind of illness, couldn't stop thinking about something I'd or someone else had said that day....and thats just the stuff my mind creates for itself- don't get me started on the actual real worries! (Money, job, family-or lack of, friends with illnesses...interviews, meetings, worried about sleeping through important stuff the next day...) I wake up and actually feel more exhausted much of the time.
I think for me, that most of this is some sort of transference (psychoanalytically talking here even though I am not qualified to do so!) Its like I worry about all these things because the bigger things are too much to deal with.

Either which way, I think it seems obvious to me that even trying to battle to get a normal sleeping pattern, the anxiety will always be my main problem and is likely to make things impossible to change. Maybe I am going to be reliant on pills for a while longer

Psychaley

I really don't know why I can't sleep, my family jokes that I'm a vampire because I'm so pale and I'm awake all night.

I haven't really experienced any side effects with mine but then I generally don't experience them with any meds. Though once I did take the tablets too late and they were still affecting me during the day: I walked into a mirror at work, asked a 'customer' if they needed any help and then realised I was talking to my own reflection. The actual customers were looking at me like I was some sort of drugged up loony.

Nothing wrong with having to take medication though. The thing that annoys me is that I get the feeling that people seem to stigmatise pills etc....my dad is on medication for anxiety/sleep disorder (like you describe, he thinks about things all the time), they work for him but everyone at his works, his friends etc are constantly on at him telling him that he needs to get off pills a.s.a.p as it 'looks bad' but then he stresses about trying to get off them or getting on a lower dose; he tries to get off the tablets himself and then the anxiety problems come back and he gets ill because his body has become used to the meds. I've had people say similar things to me when they find out I take prescribed sleeping tablets. I don't see why people see anxiety/sleeping pills as a bad thing, if you need them, you need them. I'll still try and find way of helping me sleep but untill then I'll take the tablets.

jenniewb

Psychaley wrote: »

I really don't know why I can't sleep, my family jokes that I'm a vampire because I'm so pale and I'm awake all night.

I haven't really experienced any side effects with mine but then I generally don't experience them with any meds. Though once I did take the tablets too late and they were still affecting me during the day: I walked into a mirror at work, asked a 'customer' if they needed any help and then realised I was talking to my own reflection. The actual customers were looking at me like I was some sort of drugged up loony.

Nothing wrong with having to take medication though. The thing that annoys me is that I get the feeling that people seem to stigmatise pills etc....my dad is on medication for anxiety/sleep disorder (like you describe, he thinks about things all the time), they work for him but everyone at his works, his friends etc are constantly on at him telling him that he needs to get off pills a.s.a.p as it 'looks bad' but then he stresses about trying to get off them or getting on a lower dose; he tries to get off the tablets himself and then the anxiety problems come back and he gets ill because his body has become used to the meds. I've had people say similar things to me when they find out I take prescribed sleeping tablets. I don't see why people see anxiety/sleeping pills as a bad thing, if you need them, you need them. I'll still try and find way of helping me sleep but untill then I'll take the tablets.

I'm not by any means anti-medication, its just that I have to take a fair amount already (have what turned out to be- osteoarthritus/cartilidge damage and that was just picked up on with an accidental scan- it scanned an area which included my knees!) I am having my back looked into in a month and I have hugely painful period pains- I feel like I'm never off pills! I get all sorts of good and bad effects with the pills I take, eg the stuff for my period pain means I am consitpated each time I take it, but it does mean my back pain reduces.

I just worry about what I take. I don't know what its doing inside of me and I know that there are many more others who take more pills and are fine but I do wonder and I think its the amount I'm taking- I never used to take anything but was very happy to snap open a pill at the drop of a hat when I was younger, I used to be aware of the side effects I'd inevitably get and take something else for those...

I think it was my last anti depressant that just changed everything for me. Panorama made two shows on it shortly after I had taken the decision to come off it (I felt I didn't need it anymore rather the anything else and was getting bored of the random sensations it was giving me!). Apparently it was a known side effect to become psychotic and one man even murdered his parents on the drug. He had taken it for social anxiety and had no known previous psychiatric issues. It was banned for those under 18 shortly after the documentaries. I had the side effects many others had (hot and cold flashes, weight issues, numb hands and feet at random times, "head shocks" and on and on.

Just made me think about everything I took for granted. How much faith I put into things and actually how little is known about the long term effects of anything we take, I worry that if my body is experiencing so many side effects with everything I take, that this has got to be my bodies way of saying "uh, actually? I don't like this thanks". I'd always ignored the side effects in the past, not everyone gets them and just assumed it was one of those things, a bit like always finding it hard to sleep or just liking fizzy cola sweets over chocolate: one of those things that made me me. Now I think of it a little differently and aside from anything else, adding to my already all consuming mind, more worry doesn't seem like such a good idea!

I do agree though, pills can be a huge blessing and I do intend to carry on taking those I am already on (but not without having questioned them all first!)

brians_daughter

I have been reading this thread with some interest.

I have never slept -i remember being young and my mum crying because i slept so little (poor mum!) To date,this week (mon-fri) i have slept 7 hours gggrrrr.

My GP has given me sleeping pills in the past but i only took them twice and didnt hear the children waken up and that scared me so have never taken them since. Its not a sleep anyway more of a knock you out and felt worse after the sleep the tablets induced than before.

2 of my children are the same, my youngest son is 3 and goes to bed at 10pm and is up for 4am (on a good night)

I have taken to keeping myself busy. i always have a book on the go or a hobby to fill my time. i try to make light of it by saying theres not enough hours in the day to sleep (i am a single mum to 4 children. work 60 hours a week and study ft at uni) but i would love to actually go to bed wind down and sleep

Maybe we should have a '4AM CLUB' - its the feeling alone that gets me, knowing everyone else is dreaming and snoring and relaxing whilst i am sweeping the floor for the 5th time that night

Bumpmakesfour

jenniewb wrote: »

And your children have never had any other issues? Hmmm, maybe will ask again my doctor and at least see if they can referer me so I can ask again (if the same specialist is there after so many years!)

Nope no issues.We ran out of melatonin on friday and the chemists order didn't arrive so DS had none last night and none for tonight or tomorrow.He hasn't closed his eyes since and even though the melatonin doesn't make him sleep as such it definately relaxes him.He's absolutely strung out tonight,tapping,whistling and squirming around the place...the difference without them is amazing and no doubt we'll be in for another two nights of zero sleep till we get the prescription :eek: I sleep very little,can cope on a couple of hours a night but DS is something else and can go days:(
Hope you get some sleep soon xxx

jenniewb

Bumpmakesfour wrote: »

Nope no issues.We ran out of melatonin on friday and the chemists order didn't arrive so DS had none last night and none for tonight or tomorrow.He hasn't closed his eyes since and even though the melatonin doesn't make him sleep as such it definately relaxes him.He's absolutely strung out tonight,tapping,whistling and squirming around the place...the difference without them is amazing and no doubt we'll be in for another two nights of zero sleep till we get the prescription :eek: I sleep very little,can cope on a couple of hours a night but DS is something else and can go days:(
Hope you get some sleep soon xxx

Thanks, I'm feeling a bit braver about it now and will be looking into this, hoping to get an appointment with my doctor next week (its one of those "call up on the day at 8am and if your lucky and not kept on hold for 29 minutes we'll offer you something which will undoubtably be 1-2 hours later then the actual appointment so take plenty of antiviral potions before you visit as you will be leaving with a cold"

If its any help, I've just gotten over some sort of a cough/cold and was taking something for that which was OTC and for nights (without giving away names as I'm not sure if I'm allowed to!) it really put me to sleep and am sad to have to stop it- OTC medication could help for a short time (like 2-3 days) without being too addictive and could get you through the odd night.

Youdontseeme

I used to use a certain night time cough medicine a lot for sleep, while I dont think it is addictive the amount you need to make you feel sleepy increases as you get used to it. For the price of it a bottle of plonk may do the same thing :rotfl:and taste a hell of a lot nicer (I do no thats not the answer!)

I do feel for you, the past few weeks I have been dropping off to sleep fine (which is unusal for me but work has been manic so I am b*ggered) but I keep waking up between 3 and 4 and so wide awake I have to get up. This morning I was baking browines at 4.30!

I feel like I could sleep standing up at the mo but to scared to have a nap incase I cant sleep later.

Did you try the Paul McKenna thing?
I think it works for me as you have to concentrate on the breathing / counting, you cant think of any other "guff" that goes around your head.

YDSM