Central heating with 10mm plastic pipes

mikey72

weekendwarrior wrote: »

Spend the extra and use copper.

I use plastic in houses that I am goint to sell, but in my own home I use copper.

10mm plastic uses inserts and the diameter of the hole in the inserts is tiny, perhaps 6-7mm, so the 10mm pipe size is reduced at each joint.

Copper is tried and tested, bit more expensive, but much better imho.

There is nothing wrong with plastic pipe, so you can use 15mm plastic pipe and then use compression fittings, this will give you full bore and they are often better than push fit joints!

You need inserts on 15mm plastic with compression joints as well.

K_the_engineer

Gentlemen, here's an interesting one for you.
Various manufacturers claim guarantees of up to 40-50 years on their plastic products, looks great on the literature. But, no-one will guarantee the rubber o-ring seal beyond ten years (rubber is a natural product and will 'bio' degrade). Think about it - why do you think your taps start to drip after about ten years?

Copper gets my vote.

WillowCat

aboard_epsilon wrote: »

One more thing you want to consider is ..what ever make of plastic pipe you decide choose ....in 10 year ..15 years ..who knows ..it will be obsolete ..with no fittings available for it ..and incompatible with the next trend.

i used plastic pipe, for the pipe over to my workshop ..the stuff was called Acorn........they ain't around any more ..and i have not checked weather it is compatible with any of the new stuff ..i suspect it isn't ...or does anyone no better than this .?

all the best.markj

Acorn had name changes/takeovers etc, not sure exactly what but they ended up as Hep2O.

The Hep2O metal inserts are fully compatible with the brown acorn stuff, then you can use the modern Hep fittings (or indeed copper compression fittings or any other plastic fitting) on the old pipe.

Did that a couple of years ago on the acorn fittings on my boat - originally installed in 1983 and still going strong, and the marine environment is not exactly friendly, especially flexing and vibrations that housebound pipework doesn't have to endure.;)

BRM

All good stuff in the above posts, especially the remarks about the lifetimes of pushfit joints.

I did the central heating installation in my new-build three-storey house a few years ago in 22mm and 15mm plastic. I put in all the pipe in one day with an unskilled labourer's help. It's all been fine so far. So far so good.

After I'd finished the job a fitter said to me that he liked plastic pipe but his method (on small-medium houses) was to run 10mm plastic continuous to/from each radiator from a manifold by the boiler - so the manifold is a hub with radiators connected to it like the spokes of a wheel. The advantages of this method are (1) speed and ease of installation, and (2) very few joints, all accessible - only at the manifold and at the radiators - and if they fail you'll probably get some visible leaking first.

On a big house you could run 22mm copper to a manifold on each floor and then 10mm plastic off each manifold to the rads on that floor.

bilsdean

Hi, I know this is an old post, but.... we have recently built an extension on our house and our plumber (a friend) recommends 10mm plastic pipe to connect into the existing copper pipe heating system. The new extension has concrete floors and the idea is that the pipe can be run as a single pipe to each rad without any joints therefore reducing chances of leaks. The pipes will be screeded over once installed and will hopefully give no further issues.

The plan is to run the plastic where there are concrete floors and as soon as we link into the existing house we will use copper - to avoid vermin damage.

I'm reading all sorts of differing opinions on the use of plastic, but like the idea of having no joints; there will be a fair old run from the manifold to the farthest rad (probably something like 10 or 11 metres).

Opinions please...????

aboard_epsilon

I don't know a lot ..but plastic does expand...and if not insulted under the concrete screed, will crack it....if it does not crack it with its expansion ..it'll crack it with the shock of the heat.

i don't know know they do this underfloor heating ..but they must have taken this into account in some way ..

there again underfloor heating runs at low heat 40 degrees c..where as your stuff will be 80 degrees c

all the best.markj

Leif

I'm having plastic pipes laid in screed in a 60's bungalow which had exposed copper pipes. The end run from the screed to the radiator valve is copper on the grounds that plastic looks naff, and is not as rigid. Apparently this is commonplace. If you use copper, it has to be protected from plaster and concrete otherwise it corrodes and leaks. I was quoted copper, but chose plastic in preference due to corrosion resistance, and the only obvious disadvantage I could see was - as you say - vermin damage. A rat could easily eat through one. I would not want plastic in exposed areas since it is more easily damaged, by children for instance, you cannot be sure a child won't decide to cut or melt a pipe for 'fun'. Searching online there seems to be no real concensus of opinion on copper versus plastic.

garethgas

Whether its plastic or copper, of course it will work. The question is one of appearance and durability.
Copper is tried and tested over generations and gets my vote every time.
I would use plastic in extreme cases but that's the only time.
I feel that plastic looks very DIY and hasn't stood the test of time like copper has.
I've yet to hear any nightmare stories of people who've installed copper and had problems with it. That alone would sway me.
Also, just because its used in new builds doesn't make it a good/better product.
Anyone think new houses are better built or superior to older houses?
Having said all this, I still find opinions vary so some will use it some won't.
To the OP, why can't you tell the guy who's quoted for plastic to quote again for copper?

Tucker

garethgas wrote: »

I've yet to hear any nightmare stories of people who've installed copper and had problems with it. That alone would sway me.
Also, just because its used in new builds doesn't make it a good/better product.
Anyone think new houses are better built or superior to older houses?

You have to be kidding. Our street are Barrett built from 1991. Every single house on our street (20 houses +) has had a minimum of one leak from copper piping. Most have had multiple leaks, anything upto 6 seperate leaks. 3 or 4 seems to be the average.

I've had 3 in the bathroom and one on the run up from the boiler, which seeped down inside the wooden boxing in and went undetected till my laminate started to warp.

Personally, I would never use copper again. All the leaks have been from the copper pipe themselves, not joints. The pipes went green where the leak was and they were pin hole size leaks that took time to detect, by which point the damages was beyond salvage.

You could argue the builders used a faulty batch of copper pipe. Perhaps that's so, but I've replaced much of mine with plastic and trust that far more than I'd trust copper.

One of my neighbours has got so fed up he's looking to rip out every bit of copper and redo the whole house in plastic.

27col

I remember Acorn fittings from the distant past. Very clumsy as I recall and you could not disassemble them.