House Extension

dx4100_2

Hi Everyone

Just received planning permission for a double storey side extension on our 1960s Semi and need to now tender the work out to builders etc...

Basically the new double storey side extension will give us a playroom for the kids, porch and a bigger kitchen on the ground floor. A office and a bigger bedroom for one of the kids on the first floor.

But we have other work that needs doing on the house as well.

• Shell construction of double storey extension
• New guttering etc on the roof
• New drive needs laying
• New front brick wall to replace wood panels.
• Whole house needs rewiring including extension
• Small amount of damp proof work around chimney breast
• New fire place installation.
• New Bathroom fixtures
• New Kitchen fixtures
• New Boiler, new location (in the new extension) for the boiler and plumbing for extension
• Laminate / Carpets through out

Just wondering if anyone has any advice in general on approaching all this work. We don't know how best to approach getting prices for all of the work, how much of the work should we give to one builder, the order the work should be started and finished...

Some of the stuff is obvious, like the new kitchen and bathroom... but the work regarding the plumbing, electrics, roof, extension shell etc etc is a bit more confusing... Is it best to split it up between firms ?

My current thoughts is to knock up a "tender" which I can send to a number of different builders, stating the work I want doing and getting them to answer standard questions like, what insurance do you have etc. I suppose I am wondering what work to lump together and what to get quotes for separately. What level of details should I expect back from the builders ? Obviously I want more meat than someone just giving me a final number...

I hope all this makes sense... Its all a bit foggy in my head at the moment :P

Any help welcomed!

ormus

it makes sense to include things like the brick wall/guttering within the main extension contract. as they will be on site with the brickie & scaffolding etc..
probably best to make the main contract include the roof etc, and up to plasterboard finish level.
IMHO most/all of the others should be on seperate quotes.
you can get the main contractor to install first fix for things like plumbing and waste/soil pipes. but you will need to be very sure where these pipes will need to be situated.

the electrics are the odd one out. they can be done either way. again, bear in mind, first fix.


as for bathrooms and kitchens, you might want labour only prices, and supply all the items/fittings/units yourself.


you should use the JCT minor works contract standard terms, as the basis for any tender/quote.
you can google for examples.

you do need to be fairly accurate as to what is wanted/not wanted and what you are paying for. and what the builder thinks he is quoting for.
there should be no ambiguity. thinking ahead now will pay huge dividends. less problems down the road.

richardw

Do you know what kind of bricks you want? Roof tiles etc?

What sort of window design?

Defining what your requirements are at this early stage will help a lot.

dx4100_2

Thanks to both of you for your replies... Really clealpring things up for me..

Can you expand on this "first fix" regarding the plumbing and electrics. I was thinking that at some point I would have a plumber and electrical on site working around the builders to lay the pipes / wires. Are you saying the main firm doing the extension could lay the cables / pipes in the walls and then we get the rest done by other tradesmen ?

My gut is saying I would probably be best just getting separate quotes and have proper plumbers / electricians doing the work given the whole house needs work. Thoughts?

Planning permission says we have to use the same materials / colours as the original house so I don't know if we have much scope on the materials. We will certainly decide on what style of windows we want when sorting the quotes. I hear what you say about making early concrete decesions.

Is this the right contract ? homeownercontracts.com/store/describe?name=JCT-001

iamcornholio

You will need some drawings for the extension work (ie the building regulation approval) and these should be suitably detailed and specified so that the builders just need to quote from the drawings without any guessing

For your other work, it is you who needs to specify what you want and what materials you want used, not the builders. Otherwise, you will get widely different quotes as one builder quotes for the cheapest stuff he can find and the others quotes for the stuff which he makes the best profit on

You are also entering a minefield if you are thinking of getting all different trades/firms in for different work, unless you know what you are doing in terms of planning, managing and costing. And who pays when the trades conflict or one prevents the other from working?

I would certainly not worry about choosing a specific contract until you have sorted out the best way to procure the work and get the job done. You don't really want to have 10 different people working under 10 contracts each with their own agenda

From your post, it seems that you may be better off employing someone to draw up your tenders otherwise you may be thinking you are getting a good fair priced job, and you may in fact get an expensive mediocre one

richardw

First fix is generally what needs to be installed before plastering and other finishes are done, so with electrics first fix are things like cables and socket boxes which are installed and then the wall may be plastered, the second fix would be like the socket cover and light switches.

Whoever does the building work, it must be in accordance with the planning permission details and conditions and building regulations and some may also fall in with the realms of http://www.hse.gov.uk/construction/cdm/responsibilities.htm

dx4100_2

We have professional drawings and we have been granted planning permission.

Thanks for the advice regarding materials. I will certainly start exploring the different type of material available and what I want to be used.

My job is project management, all be it in the world of software development, soI am not a mug when it comes to managing "projects", costings and timings. So I am not overly afraid of managing this project while at the same time appreciating I have no experience in this industry. The aim of this post is to get some of the basic info / terminology / things to look out for to enable me to start planning all this.

My current thoughts are (thanks to advice above) is to get one company / builder in to do.

• Extension shell to plaster board level with first fix
• Roof with loft space for storage
• Guttering
• Brick front garden wall

and also plumber and electrician to do:

• Rewire house and extension
• Plumbing and boiler relocation

I would imagine the builder of the main tender would let me know when he is ready to make room for the electrician and plumbers to come on site to do there stuff ?

Do you think I am best looking for a company that will also quote for and manage the plumbing and electrics for me.

The specialist companies in for the rest once all this main work has been completed. Organising the rest of the stuff is pretty straight forward I would of thought.

• Upstairs Bathroom
• Kitchen
• Fire place
• Damp proof chimney breast
• Laminate / Carpets
• New drive

What I want to avoid is a jack of all trades doing a crap job on something. For example, a builder trying to fit me kitchen, or do something he isn't good at like the plumbing etc. Horses for courses and all that.

dx4100_2

richardw wrote: »

First fix is generally what needs to be installed before plastering and other finishes are done, so with electrics first fix are things like cables and socket boxes which are installed and then the wall may be plastered, the second fix would be like the socket cover and light switches.

Whoever does the building work, it must be in accordance with the planning permission details and conditions and building regulations and may also fall in with the realms of

Ok thanks for that.

The problem I have is the WHOLE house needs rewiring. The current wiring and fuse box etc etc won't support the extension. So I presumed the best approach would be to get a proper electrician in to do the job lot working around the builder.

How do you think I should approach this ? Get the building company to basically do the cables and plugs and then get the proper electrician to then connect all up to the new fuse box (forgiven my lack of terminology).

richardw

One of the problems with having your own electrician and plumber on a project is Builder's work in connection with these services.
Many electricians and plumbers expect the builder to have made chases in brickwork and holes through walls etc so they can install cables and pipes in the building with ease. Conflict arises when the builder's work hasn't been done correctly and the electricians and plumbers can't do their work in accordance with regulations, a blame situation often arises and can be time consuming to resolve.
If you want to avoid sorting out this kind of problem, then do a bit of risk analysis and make the builder responsible for that bit of the plumbing and electric works.

dx4100_2

richardw wrote: »

One of the problems with having your own electrician and plumber on a project is Builder's work in connection with these services.
Many electricians and plumbers expect the builder to have made chases in brickwork and holes through walls etc so they can install cables and pipes in the building with ease. Conflict arises when the builder's work hasn't been done correctly and the electricians and plumbers can't do their work in accordance with regulations, a blame situation often arises and can be time consuming to resolve.
If you want to avoid sorting out this kind of problem, then do a bit of risk analysis and make the builder responsible for that bit of the plumbing and electric works.

Cheers for that...

I think I am seeing this more clearly now. So its defo worth getting the main building contractor to sort out the plumbing and electrics within the extension.

This is telling me the first thing I need to do before starting the building work is to have the current house re-wired with enough capacity for the extension. Then get the builders to do the extra bits in the extension.

Cheers

richardw

dx4100 wrote: »

the first thing I need to do before starting the building work is to have the current house re-wired with enough capacity for the extension.

This kind of thing can be put under a something that is often known as 'Enabling Works', perhaps consider other enabling works that may be required.