MSE News: Consumer groups urge action on energy prices at summit

Mandelbrot

magyar wrote: »

This is from a recent report published in Austria. I'm actually surprised JUST how much cheaper it all is here.

<barcharts for residential Gas & Electricity prices in 14 European capitals, 2010 - source: E-Control and VaasaETT, 2011>

Some later info - HEPI (Household Energy Price Index), Sept 2011











Note that the UK (London in this report) has one of the lowest tax elements, and a low to average distribution cost element (as a percentage of the 'all-in' price).

Consumerist

harz99 wrote: »

. . . So all the consumers and their concerns around the complexity and multitude of the available tariffs, which make it damn hard to switch are just brushed aside.

You may find this Ofgem Press Release of 14 October 2011 of some interest.

grizzly1911

As usual it is all the consumers fault, not me of course but once you have done all the stuff suggested what then?

I saw a special committee grilling a couple of months ago and El Scottish Energy represenattive said that fuel costs were higher in Spain but that they were a lot more stable, without the large increases we see here, sighting government policy/direction being the influence in each case.

Pincher

"With the standing charge set by Ofgem suppliers will only be able to change the unit price, which means that consumers will be able to compare prices at a glance. For these standard tariffs all other complications like different tier prices and complex discount structures will be removed. So the lower the price the smaller the bill, with no exceptions."

If you switch, it's not going to be for a standard tariff.

They are only going to complicate things by adding, say a prize draw every month, so it's not part of the tariff.

magyar

grizzly1911 wrote: »

As usual it is all the consumers fault, not me of course but once you have done all the stuff suggested what then?

I saw a special committee grilling a couple of months ago and El Scottish Energy represenattive said that fuel costs were higher in Spain but that they were a lot more stable, without the large increases we see here, sighting government policy/direction being the influence in each case.

Doesn't that just tell you either prices in Spain have been too high in the past, or ours have been too cheap? Would you rather have had Spain's stable, higher prices?

Mandelbrot

grizzly1911 wrote: »

I saw a special committee grilling a couple of months ago and El Scottish Energy represenattive said that fuel costs were higher in Spain but that they were a lot more stable, without the large increases we see here, sighting government policy/direction being the influence in each case.

43% of retail price in Spain is from wholesale price, as against over 70% in UK. Rest of retail price due to level of Govt tax & distribution costs (which don't change much). So naturally the UK price fluctuates more as wholesale prices vary.

adwat

Cameron says "Switch tariffs" - So it's our fault that prices are high then David??

Cameron says "Insulate better - use less energy" - So we all spend money insulating our homes even more (15ft of insulation in the loft will be the next recommended minimum no doubt!) and thereby solve a major problem for the energy companies, which is the small problem of having to invest some money (profits dontcha know?) into building new generating capability. In short we all end up paying more for less usage... and the energy companies just keep the old creaking system going on a shoestring. Same old same old in this country I'm afraid. Makes me ashamed to be English... look at France - there is no comparison, they export energy to us and have the cheapest energy in europe.

Remember that old Tory - Harold Macmillan - who said that Thatcher was wrong to be "selling off the family silver" when she started on her orgy of privatisation... turned out to be right after all I think. So much for "competition" and "private sector efficiency"... you gotta laugh, except thousands of old people will die this winter as a result of insufficient heating, so not so funny after all I guess.

magyar

adwat wrote: »

Makes me ashamed to be English... look at France - there is no comparison, they export energy to us and have the cheapest energy in europe.

Why are you ashamed to be English? Would you rather be Danish and paying the highest energy prices in Europe? Aren't you happy to be paying about a third less for your electricity and and 50% less for your gas than the European average?

adwat

magyar wrote: »

Why are you ashamed to be English? Would you rather be Danish and paying the highest energy prices in Europe? Aren't you happy to be paying about a third less for your electricity and and 50% less for your gas than the European average?

I would rather be paying much much less for my energy thank you very much. Rather like we used to before the utilities were "sold" (not forgetting that they were owned by us so therefore selling them was rather naughty to begin with...) - it makes me ashamed that successive governments think so little of their people that they allow this to happen.

Just 10 years ago, domestic heating costs were a non-significant part of my budget. I've seen them increase several fold over that period of time. If you think that that is something to be proud of then so be it, personally it makes me ashamed.

2sides2everystory

Mandelbrot wrote: »

Some later info - HEPI (Household Energy Price Index), Sept 2011











Note that the UK (London in this report) has one of the lowest tax elements, and a low to average distribution cost element (as a percentage of the 'all-in' price).

Note also that Copenhagen is shown in the top two of the costs/kWh lists for both gas and electricity but that 60% of Danish homes are heated by district heating which I suspect probably does not show up in either graph?