Please Help! Problems with my bank‏ - ATM Fraud

adamp8

Two months ago I requested a new debit card and pin reminder as I had misplaced my old one. A fortnight later I still had not recieved my card so I contacted my bank who informed me that my debit card had been used by someone and that there had been 11 withdrawals of £300 meaning that I was now out of pocket £3300. The bank carried out their own investigation in conjuction with the local police and come to the conclusion that they believe the debit card and pin reminder had been successfully delivered and that they were declining the claim.

The police have advised me that the CCTV footage they retrieved is not sufficient to draw any conclusions from and I have no way of proving that I did not recieve the debit card just as the bank have no way of proving that my card was intercepted. I have recently finished university and have already left with student debts hanging over my head, I can not afford to loose this huge amount of money.

The bank are suspicious as I had made a deposit prior to loosing my debit card but I can account for this deposit and have documented proof to show where this came from. In addition to this I can also prove my whereabouts during the times and dates when the withdrawals were made.

The financial institution involved with Nationwide Building Society and they have escalated my claim 3 times but to no avail. I am in desperate need of the money which has been stolen from me but don't know where to turn. The police have referred me to the action fraud helpline who have been no help at all. The bank will allow me to take this to the financial ombudsman but I have no idea what my legal rights are and what code of conduct the banks are bound by. I don't know how to prove that I didnt recieve the card and that the withdrawals were not made by me. Any help you could provide would be greatly appreciated.

crazyguy

Well it looks to me from your inital post, ( up something creek without a paddle )

Seriously you need to get whatever evidence you can and make sure that it guarantees beyond all resonable doubt that you never withdrew any amounts that they claim you have taken.

If you have esculated this a few times then I would say that the FOS would probably not do a lot here unless it is in black and white in front of them and again I refer to the point conclusive evidence that backs up your case, if you do get this together and go through this chanel I believe it would take between 6-12 months to resolve, as the likely event will be that the bank dispute it and then it will go to another adjudicator.

Forget action fraud, useless bunch. Police again they see this as a civil matter and therefore the onus is on the governing bodies to deal with ie, the FOS & FSA.

If it were me in your position and I had enough evidence to back up my defence then I would write once more to the head office via recorded delivery and state that you are now going to take legal action against them, via the Small Claims Court.
( give them a timescale of 7-14 days before commencing with this )

( Take note only go the legal route if you have 100% conclusive proof that this was not of your own doing )

adamp8

Forgive my naievety but what sort of evidence can I realistically obtain? I have letters from the Student Loans Company and my wage slips both of which go in to a separate account. However I did save up most of the money at home myself and only decided to put it in the bank following a burglary at home. It was only conincidently that following my deposit all this happened.

The CCTV is enough to establish that it wasn't me but thats about it. As my withdrawal limit is £300 a day, what the fraudsters did was go to an ATM at 23:50, take out 300 and then wait till 00:10 and take out another £300. The only proof I have of my whereabouts is my family members to can testify that I was at home in bed like most reasonable people!

Is it a case of me having to prove that it wasn't me withdrawing my money or the bank having to prove that it was me? At the moment it seems that I am guilty until I can prove my own innocence!

I have written to them advising that if I am not satisfied with the outcome of this final escalation then I will take it before the financial ombudmans and then the small claims court. I am however dubious as I don't really have much to back my case up!

userfun

Maybe the financial ombudsman could offer you some advice

crazyguy

Ok I think the actual money side of things as the deposit you made are not the real issue, But try and get as much documentation as possible together to show where this money came from.

The problem with the CCTV, if you are actualy looking at the Banks own CCTV is that it is quite poor quality partner this with the times of the transactions will make for not the clearest of images, yes having family state you were indoors is an advantage however I dont think that is conclusive enough to warrant a legal challenge, have you looked at the area where this happened as there could also be local CCTV and that may contain better images to back up your deffence.

adamp8

Well I did attempt to go and obtain the CCTV footage myself but my attempts were in vain, apparently the fraudsters have rights under the data protection act! The police however were able to recover a 2 or 3 separate pieces of CCTV footage but in their words all this shows is, "a male in a hoody covering his face". There were no cars involved and all the ATMs used based in small villages surrounding Leicester.

crazyguy

And is this near to where you live ?

Also yes they are right to say that you cannot see it but I am trying to establish if there are indeed any clearer images out of the ones they have seen, from your conversations with the Police did they say that there were no clear ones and all they did see was a hooded male,

Basicaly to go the legal route here as I think will be the only way to recover anything is going to be quite costly, if you want to take a chance with the FOS then do so but be prepared for a long wait and a possible no further action/ case dropped letter to come.

jalexa

adamp8 wrote: »

Is it a case of me having to prove that it wasn't me withdrawing my money or the bank having to prove that it was me?

No, the bank must prove that it was you or prove that you have been grossly negligent.

It is not my intention to doubt anything you say but rather to focus on eradicating inconsistencies in any argument you use.

Before that I want to counter the "anti-FOS" arguments. The FOS argument may (or may not) be right but you have nothing to lose. If you have reached "deadlock" or 8 weeks has passed you are entitled to ask the FOS to consider the issue. Be warned it may take up to a year.:(

You said "The bank carried out their own investigation in conjuction with the local police and come to the conclusion that they believe the debit card and pin reminder had been successfully delivered".

In relation to the "police" do you have that in writing and what were the *exact* words used by Nationwide? Police involvement is "strange" and I'm reluctant to accept that as "accurate". Given that the CCTV appears to be of or near to the ATM how did Nationwide make the leap to the "debit card and PIN reminder had been successfully delivered"?

Do you share a letter box and were you asked any "trick" questions related to your letter box?

Was the ATM used a "local ATM"?

There is an obvious inconsistency in the Nationwide "police" argument in that the "police explanation" you provide does not support the Nationwide "conclusion".

The first thing I would suggest you do is make a £10 Subject Access Request of Nationwide requiring provision of all the information they hold on you (and you are entitled to - refer to the ICO website for a template letter), including copy correspondence, complaint logs, call logs and call transcripts.

Then try to drive a wedge through any inconsistencies in the information provided, (no information is an inconsistency), and in particular look for any reference to "police". No reference either it didn't happen or Nationwide have shot themselves in the foot by witholding your data. Drive your wedge.

adamp8

Yes all the ATM's used are within a 20 minute drive of where I live except one cashpoint which was used after I had discovered the fraud and the card was retained by the atm, this cashpoint was located in Marble Arch, Central London.

The images they have recovered they say are sufficient to identify that it was myself but not sufficient enough to make any sort of positive identification.

ihateyes

the bank needs to prove it wasnt you, opposed to you proving it wasnt you.

They are reneging on this.

ask them to clarify which cash machines were used, and their locations.... find out if they are local.

if they are have a look to see if there are CCTV cameras in the street. The CCTV on ATMS is normally decent enough to identify someone.

If there are street CCTV they can track the person to see if they get in a car, then track them using the registration plates, buting things like this involve REAL police work, which coppers of today arent interested in,.

crazyguy

Jalexa has given some good advice,

Also the Marble Arch in London cashpoint is a fair distance from you and should be enough for the Bank to investigate this properly as it does seem to be a rather lapse investigation at present.

I would also ask the bank about the Marble Arch CCTV as there will be a lot more picture in that area and one maybe with the persons hood down ?