The age issue

ppc_guy

this whole parking lark is a bizarre one to me. We pay the council tax but they ticket us for parking wrong and nobody complains (or not in the numbers that do for PPC's). Yet we dont pay a landowner and when we get ticketed all hell breaks lose. I know most people dont like what i do and i certainly dont like what some in the same usiness as me do but i wont be able to change that however i ALWAYS try and operate ethically and fairer than most in the business. I dont have ANY ANPR sites, nor do i do any maximum stay sites. thse dont make sense even to me. However surely you have to feel for the little shop owner with 2 spaces who loses money and trade because people have just nipped into the fast food joint accross the road. Barriers are the solve all but are expensive. Some quotes we had were IRO £5000 for supply and install. ok these were ticket barriers but evn so the manual metal barrier is not practical for anything other than periodic mass use (football grounds on football days) the small shop with a £14k profit will not be able to afford £5k on a barrier he woudl be better of letting it keep getting abused.... BUT is this fair?
Who is to say wha his losses are from mr X who just drove on past? If this was an expensive furniture store it could be thousands (i know we on about a corner shop so probably £'s) so in theory if you park in a premium business you all on here would think it fair if the ticket/invoice/scam/*insert term here was for £1000? because that covers the landowners losses?
as for making the driver responsible this is obviously good for me as there is a root to the blame but im not majorly affected either way i dont think.

ppc_guy

That would be age discrinamrion. If you read some of my other posts you will see that "toe dipping" isn't my game. i rather ask questions and get answers.

Fergie76

ppc_guy wrote: »

this whole parking lark is a bizarre one to me. We pay the council tax but they ticket us for parking wrong and nobody complains (or not in the numbers that do for PPC's). Yet we dont pay a landowner and when we get ticketed all hell breaks lose. I know most people dont like what i do and i certainly dont like what some in the same usiness as me do but i wont be able to change that however i ALWAYS try and operate ethically and fairer than most in the business. I dont have ANY ANPR sites, nor do i do any maximum stay sites. thse dont make sense even to me. However surely you have to feel for the little shop owner with 2 spaces who loses money and trade because people have just nipped into the fast food joint accross the road. Barriers are the solve all but are expensive. Some quotes we had were IRO £5000 for supply and install. ok these were ticket barriers but evn so the manual metal barrier is not practical for anything other than periodic mass use (football grounds on football days) the small shop with a £14k profit will not be able to afford £5k on a barrier he woudl be better of letting it keep getting abused.... BUT is this fair?
Who is to say wha his losses are from mr X who just drove on past? If this was an expensive furniture store it could be thousands (i know we on about a corner shop so probably £'s) so in theory if you park in a premium business you all on here would think it fair if the ticket/invoice/scam/*insert term here was for £1000? because that covers the landowners losses?
as for making the driver responsible this is obviously good for me as there is a root to the blame but im not majorly affected either way i dont think.

But surely if the retailers are losing so much money, by people using their spaces that they feel the need to contract out PPC, then £5k is a small price to pay?

Or is it the fact that PPC's won't install them as then there will be no need for PPC's?

ppc_guy

Again as a PPC im personally not majorly bothered as i would make a mark up on the barrier and install as well as obtain the repair contract. Most PPC's as you all well know dont charge the retailer so £0 for PPC or £5000 for barrier does make a big difference.

Sirdan

Who is to say wha his losses are from mr X who just drove on past? If this was an expensive furniture store it could be thousands (i know we on about a corner shop so probably £'s) so in theory if you park in a premium business you all on here would think it fair if the ticket/invoice/scam/*insert term here was for £1000? because that covers the landowners losses?

That point may apply to a single unit where the store owns the car park.

However in retail parks the stores do not own the car park or even the units they operate from.
If the stores in retail parks actually owned or even rented the car park space you would expect to see car parks spaces allocated to each store and appropriately labelled as such ..but this is not the case.
The stores rent their units from the landowner and as such their customers are allowed access to the car park.

This means that the number of visitors / shoppers into the car park has no effect on the income of the landowner ..unless a store goes bust because of parking issues ...can't really see that happening.

If your man visiting the furniture store drives on ..they lose out but they still pay the landowner the same rent ....unless the rent is a % of their profit ..I bet it's not !

Supermarkets are different as they usually do own the land.

However it could be argued that if a non supermarket customer takes a space in their half full car park which is free ..have they really lost a customer ..surely that customer just parks in a free space..

Claims for losses must be based on a genuine calculated pre estimate of loss..since there is no way to know what a customer may or may not spend I fail to see how the pre estimate of all these businesses always falls between £60 -£150 ?
The only time a loss might be recoversble is in a fee paying car park where the loss is the fee for the amount of time parked ..but PPCs NEVER EVER try to claim this do they ?


PS If I visit a retail park and visit the expensive furniture store but they don't have what I want even after a long time browsing ..do I get an invoice because my spend is £0 and I MAY have taken a space that was to be used by someone else who MAY have made a purchase ?

ppc_guy

Nice reply,

As i said i dont operate on ANY retail parks as it is pointless. Also supermarkets i would only ever focus on disabled bay abuse. ( i know blue badges have no weight on private land)

With regard to browsing i would say you were intending to be a customer as opposed to not. Customers cover those who recieve a product or service in this case the service is the viewing of stock

Sirdan

As i said i dont operate on ANY retail parks as it is pointless. Also supermarkets i would only ever focus on disabled bay abuse. ( i know blue badges have no weight on private land)

So accepting that blue badges "have no weight on private land" how do you "focus on disabled bay abuse" ??

You certainly can't tell if someone is disabled (by the definition in the Equality Act) or not just by looking at them..so how exactly will you direct your "focus" ?

ppc_guy

disabled badges would be specified as a valid permit.

Sirdan

ppc_guy wrote: »

disabled badges would be specified as a valid permit.

Nice try but that would be unlawful.

A person who is legally defined as disabled by the criteria in the Equality Act is entitled in law to use any reasonable adjustment which the landowner / car park operator provides.
(NB They are required in law to provide such adjustments by virtue of that same Act ,it's not optional.)

The entitlement to use such adjustment is provided for in law unconditionally.

To attempt to impose a condition such as a "valid permit" would be unlawful. Particularly (but not exclusively) because it would discriminate against those who are legally defined as disabled but who do not qualify for blue badges.

funkycoldribena

Whilst I despise your industry (and council for that matter) its nice to see this thread hasnt turned into a slanging match as usual.