Savings, Guarantee Pension Credit, Housing Benefit & Council Tax Benefit

Sixer

Whiteknight and annmarj are correct, OP. Where you have quoted "personal or work-related pensions" - this applies to private pensions, either personal or through work, NOT to state pensions.

Pollycat

Annemarj
thanks for that.

I guess we'll just have to wait and see what DWP say.

Mum has had 3 letters from DWP but is waiting for me to go up before opening them so maybe I'll know more early next week.

To lose CTB & HB will cost Mum an extra £351.06 per month, that's a massive amount.

That's the difference between what she's paying to the council currently (only heating and warden, no council tax) and what she'd pay in full rent, heating, warden and 75% of council tax.

That will have a big impact on her standard of living.
Talk about giving with one hand and taking it away with another. :mad:

Fingers crossed that she'll still get guarantee pension credit.

Pollycat

Sixer wrote: »

Whiteknight and annmarj are correct, OP. Where you have quoted "personal or work-related pensions" - this applies to private pensions, either personal or through work, NOT to state pensions.

I do appreciate that, but I can't tell them about the increase in her state pension, they have to work it out and advise us.

My post wasn't really about whether I should notify them about an increase in her savings or an increase in her pension (or even that she is now a widow), it was about whether she would continue to get CTB & HB.

Thanks

Pollycat

Tory70 wrote: »

Pretty cheap for rent and council tax, all things considered.

You need to read what I wrote.
I didn't say that she's paying £351.06 rent and council tax.

I said:

Pollycat wrote: »

That's the difference between what she's paying to the council currently (only heating and warden, no council tax) and what she'd pay in full rent, heating, warden and 75% of council tax.

Tory70 wrote: »

But she does now have over £30k in savings doesn't she? Surely that will help maintain a very comfortable standard of living.

Yes, I guess her savings will bring in (based on approx 3% interest) about £960 per annum, £80 per month - which will harldy cover the additional £351.06 per month that she'll pay in rent and council tax if she doesn't get guarantee pension credit.

sunnyone

Pollycat wrote: »

You need to read what I wrote.
I didn't say that she's paying £351.06 rent and council tax.

I said:





Yes, I guess her savings will bring in (based on approx 3% interest) about £960 per annum, £80 per month - which will harldy cover the additional £351.06 per month that she'll pay in rent and council tax if she doesn't get guarantee pension credit.

Then your mum will have to do as we do and use the savings to live on, it will easily last her lifetime as she is over 25 and if it didnt she can reapply for HB/LHA/CTB when she is elagable for it.

The aged do pretty well on PC in relation to younger people, your mum has already been living with substancial savings after selling her house, anyone younger would lose all means tested benefits.

Pollycat

Tory70 wrote: »

Apologies for misreading. However, am I correct in thinking that she will only pay £351.06 extra?

As I said in my post #13

Pollycat wrote: »

To lose CTB & HB will cost Mum an extra £351.06 per month, that's a massive amount.

That's the difference between what she's paying to the council currently (only heating and warden, no council tax) and what she'd pay in full rent, heating, warden and 75% of council tax.

Only pay £351.06 extra?

Lets put this into perspective:
If her state pension is increased to £102.15 per week and it is assumed that her savings count as £1 income per week for every £500 of savings, she may get a small amount of savings pension credit but will not be eligible for guarantee pension credit as her 'income' will be over the £137.35 for a single person.

The £1 for every £500 of savings equates to 5% interest.
It's a pity that it's impossible to get that rate of return.

So, out of her £102.15 per week 'income', she will have to pay £78.56 per week rent/heating/warden and £17.65 per week council tax.
So she is left with £6.03 per week to cover electricity, water, phone, contents insurance and food.

Add to that her estimated £80 per month interest on investments (£18.46 per week) then she will have less than £25 per week to cover the above.

Tory70 wrote: »

Is there a reason she can't actually use the savings instead of relying on the interest? Are they accessible? Surely at her age, she should be looking to spend a bit and be as comfortable as possible?

So, based on what I've said earlier, she will have to use her savings and the interest on those savings simply to live, not to give her a 'very comfortable standard of living'.

Pollycat

sunnyone wrote: »

Then your mum will have to do as we do and use the savings to live on, it will easily last her lifetime as she is over 25 and if it didnt she can reapply for HB/LHA/CTB when she is elagable for it.

The aged do pretty well on PC in relation to younger people, your mum has already been living with substancial savings after selling her house, anyone younger would lose all means tested benefits.

Yes, of couse she will have to use her savings to live on if it turns out she is no longer eligible for guarantee pension credit & CTB & HB.

I'm not interested in 'anyone younger', I'm focused on my Mum.

This thread was not about whether I should notify DWP about an increase in Mum's savings or an increase in her pension (or even that she is now a widow), or if she should expect to live on her savings as some other people do, it was about whether she would continue to get CTB & HB.

Pollycat

Tory70 wrote: »

I'm very sorry that my posts appear to have offended you. Personally, I think it is reasonable for the Government to expect your Mum (or anyone) to use their very healthy savings before asking for money from the public purse. I also think that £30k is more than enough for an older person to maintain a very comfortable standard of living - bearing in mind that will also be getting a state pension for day to day living. Unless, of course, the savings have been earmarked as a tidy inheritance? :cool:

I think your question has now been answered so I'll bow out.

Your posts have not offended me.

Tory70 wrote: »

Unless, of course, the savings have been earmarked as a tidy inheritance? :cool:

apart from this.

You have no knowledge of me, my financial situation or my family.

I have no need at all of any money, however great or small, that my Mum may possibly leave on her death.

I can't understand why any thread that mentions benefits gets jumped on by somebody banging on about what's fair in their eyes and insinuating that people are trying to get more than they are entitled to.

My Mum and Dad have always been upfront with organisations such as DWP, county councils and local councils.

I said earlier in this thread:

Pollycat wrote: »

About 6 years ago Mum & Dad moved into council-owned, warden controlled senior people's accommodation and put their house up for sale (old terrace).

They were in receipt of Savings Pensions Credit at the time and the day they received the money from the house sale, I phoned up DWP to report the change in circumstances.

A few months later, I noticed they were still paying Savings PC so rang up again and the guy said that as they had an assessed period, any change in their savings did not affect their entitlement to Savings PC.
He actually said 'even if they win the lottery they will still get Pension Credit until the end of the assessed income period'.

My parents would never dream of claiming anything that they were not entitled to. My Mum would not be able to sleep if she thought she wasn't entitled to something that DWP were paying to her.
In fact, if it turns out that she is entitled to guarantee pension credit/CTB/HB, I'll know that I'll have to sit down with her and go through it as she'll be convinced she's not entitled to so much money.
And I know that periodically, she'll keep asking for assurances that she is entitled to it.

I resent the insinuation that I and/or my Mum are trying to get benefits that she is not entitled to.

FWIW, my Dad fully funded his permanent stay in a care home - out of his savings.
There was no intent to get out of paying what he was liable to pay according to the law.

It's not about 'asking for money from the public purse'.

It's about what she is entitled to by law.

If she is not entitled to guarantee pension credit and therefore HB & CTB, then so be it.

If she is entitled to it, then of course she will take it.

She has worked hard all her life (as did my Dad) so is entitled to whatever benefits are due to her - based on how government legislation assesses her income and savings.

I didn't ask if you (or sunnyone or anybody else) thought it only fair that she should live on her savings, I didn't ask for your opinion on whether the rent & council tax she might end up paying was reasonable or not.
I asked if, in the circumstances outlined in my first post, she would still be entitled to guarantee pension credit, CTB & HB.

End of.

sunnyone

Pollycat wrote: »

As I said in my post #13


Only pay £351.06 extra?

Lets put this into perspective:
If her state pension is increased to £102.15 per week and it is assumed that her savings count as £1 income per week for every £500 of savings, she may get a small amount of savings pension credit but will not be eligible for guarantee pension credit as her 'income' will be over the £137.35 for a single person.

The £1 for every £500 of savings equates to 5% interest.
It's a pity that it's impossible to get that rate of return.

So, out of her £102.15 per week 'income', she will have to pay £78.56 per week rent/heating/warden and £17.65 per week council tax.
So she is left with £6.03 per week to cover electricity, water, phone, contents insurance and food.

Add to that her estimated £80 per month interest on investments (£18.46 per week) then she will have less than £25 per week to cover the above.



So, based on what I've said earlier, she will have to use her savings and the interest on those savings simply to live, not to give her a 'very comfortable standard of living'.

Our savings and investments are making pennies per annum just like everyone else's so you point is moot, younger people have to live on their savings too and my outgoings are more than my sickness benfit, not leaving a penny so our saving are reducing week on week and we have a son to keep as well not just one elderly woman whose out goings will be nothing in comparison to a families out goings.

Perspective means seeing everything on the same level and not changing the level to suit a personel situation.

My elderly relatives are also living on their savings as they made sure the saved for retirement, whats the diffrence between them and another elderly person who sold their home and had most likely had/has more capital than my relatives have savings?

Nothing apart from timing, wait until you get the OAP version of IS with much more generous terms and then get savings you win big time, have savings on retirment and get zilch apart from your basic pension.

Pollycat

Look, sunnyone, I'm not really interested in your own financial situation, whether you have a son to keep or whether younger people have to live on their savings.

I'll ask you this one question:

Do you claim all the benefits you are entitled to?

I'm sure the answer will be 'yes'.

And in that case, why are you so against someone (possibly) being entitled to claim CTB & HB even though they have savings?

The key word here is 'entitled'.

FGS, I've highlighted the word enough in my previous post.

Why can't you understand that I'm not talking about benefit fraud or your opinion on what's fair here?.
I'm talking about what the DWP say my Mum is entitled to receive.

And that's what I asked in my original post.

In case you've still not got the point, here it is again:

Pollycat wrote: »

As she's over 75, DWP have given her an assessed income period without an end date for her Pension Credit.
This means that she does not have to tell them if there is a change in her savings or pensions.
So she will continue to receive the Guarantee Pension Credit - I think.

I know that I need to tell the local council about the change in her savings (obviously they've doubled) and the widow's pension she will receive from Dad's occupational pension and I'll do that as soon as we've been to the Building Society (next week).

I'm assuming that as she will continue to receive Guarantee Pension Credit she will still be entitled to CTB & HB, even though her savings are over the £16,00 limit.
Am I right?

You will note (I hope) that there is no intention of not telling the local council about her savings.
That would be benefit fraud, wouldn't it!

sunnyone wrote: »

Perspective means seeing everything on the same level and not changing the level to suit a personel situation.

I'm not changing the level to suit a personal situation, I'm interested in what the Government (& therefore local council) say my Mum is entitled to.
I don't give a toss whether you think it's unfair to you or your elderly relatives or not.