working tax credit overpayments, your veiws

hiacekim

Hello to all............I have made an appointment with my MP the Attorney General ,to discuss tax credit over-payments and the current appeal system. I would like to able to demonstrate to him the depth of feeling from as many of the members as possible.

If you want to show support please post a message or a short tale of your experience with this part of the system.

We have been told that we owe £2,745 for overpayment.
We have phoned and told them of each and every change of circumstance. (transcripts can be ordered of the last 3)
We looked into the overpayment, it was because although my wife was working full time and this was in our paper work from them, the £2,533 I had contributed first through JSA and then ESA during 2010/11 had been assigned as income based.

After some phone calls ,I found out That when one partner is working full time the other partner will never receive income based only contribution based awards. We never knew anything about the two until I tried to get help with dentistry.

We appealed chased and chased ,as it was part of IVA income and just over 6 months later tax credits have denied our appeal on the grounds we had not met our responsibility's ,namely not spotting their mistake .

Result no payments at all for just over 4 years starting now.
IVA now failed after 2 and 1/2 years and £9,500 pounds paid out.

They judge themselves and we as many others I suspect have no recourse.

So on the 16th of September I will ask the Attorney General why, we are so vulnerable to this system , any extra proof of its failings would be very helpful .

Look forward to any replies thanks Kim

krisskross

hiacekim wrote: »

Hello to all............I have made an appointment with my MP the Attorney General ,to discuss tax credit over-payments and the current appeal system. I would like to able to demonstrate to him the depth of feeling from as many of the members as possible.

If you want to show support please post a message or a short tale of your experience with this part of the system.

We have been told that we owe £2,745 for overpayment.
We have phoned and told them of each and every change of circumstance. (transcripts can be ordered of the last 3)
We looked into the overpayment, it was because although my wife was working full time and this was in our paper work from them, the £2,533 I had contributed first through JSA and then ESA during 2010/11 had been assigned as income based.

After some phone calls ,I found out That when one partner is working full time the other partner will never receive income based only contribution based awards. We never knew anything about the two until I tried to get help with dentistry.

We appealed chased and chased ,as it was part of IVA income and just over 6 months later tax credits have denied our appeal on the grounds we had not met our responsibility's ,namely not spotting their mistake .

Result no payments at all for just over 4 years starting now.
IVA now failed after 2 and 1/2 years and £9,500 pounds paid out.

They judge themselves and we as many others I suspect have no recourse.

So on the 16th of September I will ask the Attorney General why, we are so vulnerable to this system , any extra proof of its failings would be very helpful .

Look forward to any replies thanks Kim

Don't quite understand this . Are you saying that benefit income of £2533 caused an overpayment of £2745?

Why would whether it was income or contribution based make a difference to tax credits as it was still income? You would only have been entitled to contribution based JSA or ESA as your wife was working full time.

So is it a tax credit overpayment or a wrongly paid benefit overpayment?

hiacekim

Hi thanks for your reply

Don't quite understand this . Are you saying that benefit income of £2533 caused an overpayment of £274?

The JSA /ESA had been taken as part of our total income, as they had put income based this had generated the highest payment scale. As they would have assessed us on having JSA/ESA as sole income, as a couple. When this was discovered we dropped from £574 a month to £39 a month.

Why would whether it was income or contribution based make a difference to tax credits as it was still income? You would only have been entitled to contribution based JSA or ESA as your wife was working full time.

That's our point, they perhaps they should have Known that, and the Income / contribution should never have been an issue.

So is it a tax credit overpayment or a wrongly paid benefit overpayment?

Tax credit overpayment .

Thanks Kim

Caz3121

hiacekim wrote: »

As they would have assessed us on having JSA/ESA as sole income, as a couple.

what did they have as the income figure on your award letter?

hiacekim

Caz3121 wrote: »

what did they have as the income figure on your award letter?

They had my wifes earnings at £25,180
and my taxable social security benefits £2,533
total £27,713.00

Thanks Kim

krisskross

hiacekim wrote: »

They had my wifes earnings at £25,180
and my taxable social security benefits £2,533
total £27,713.00

Thanks Kim

Surely you realised that on that income you weren't entitled to anything?

hiacekim

krisskross wrote: »

Surely you realised that on that income you weren't entitled to anything?

As we were dealing with an IVA , rent rebates, rates rebates starting and then stopping because of income sources fluctuating.
A Guardianship order,for us to take a 2 year old granddaughter. A child suitability assessment that lasted for months , (2 years on and still not been to court)
I being asked by child social services to give up my job to care for our granddaughter and then 3 months later , told I could not care for her because of my health conditions.
Then my wife, a year out for child care, then back again to work, with me now no income house husband.
Previous awards had been all over the place in the range hundreds of pounds . So nothing was as simple as that, "nothing in life is simple"

Tax credits were kept up to date with all details and changes to circumstances , and they are not disputing that. we failed to notice their mistake
thanks Kim

Sam____2

when you apply for tax credits they ask about income based benefits.

When you are awarded benefits of any kind they write to you to tell you what you will be receiving and on those letters it states wether or not you are on conts based or income based benefits.
Are you saying you informed them you were on income based benefits when indeed you were not?
Sorry I'm just a bit confused by what your getting at

Sixer

The OP has had an overpayments appeal denied on the basis they should have a) understood the difference between contribution and income based JSA/ESA, b) known that one was treated differently to the other vis a vis tax credits, and c) did not draw HMRC's attention to HMRC's error in this treatment when they received their award notice.

OP is doubly upset because this overpayment and refusal of appeal had a knock-on effect on their IVA and his circumstances have seriously suffered from it.

I have sympathy. These differences appear arcane to most of us. The OP kept HMRC informed of all their changes of circumstance. Award notices aren't particularly clear.

Sam____2

If they informed HMRC they were getting income based benefits but were getting conts based I don't see how it can be HMRC's fault that they gave wrong information.
I've always found any awards letters to be pretty concise, but that's just my experience.

OP if your going to your MP etc hopefully they can do somethething about it for you. It sounds like you have/had a lot on your plate.

hiacekim

Sixer wrote: »

The OP has had an overpayments appeal denied on the basis they should have a) understood the difference between contribution and income based JSA/ESA, b) known that one was treated differently to the other vis a vis tax credits, and c) did not draw HMRC's attention to HMRC's error in this treatment when they received their award notice.

OP is doubly upset because this overpayment and refusal of appeal had a knock-on effect on their IVA and his circumstances have seriously suffered from it.

I have sympathy. These differences appear arcane to most of us. The OP kept HMRC informed of all their changes of circumstance. Award notices aren't particularly clear.

Thanks for your post....I think you have summed it up just about right. Our income was at the time not 29K it was 16k then 19k ,23k As we have one income now ,it will be 26k ish going on. They are taking our child tax credits to pay back the sum and we are making an offer to end the IVA early, if that fails we shall declare BR and add it in .

Sorry if I have roused a few members, never intended too .
All I wanted to know was, of any other members who felt frustation of the system, and shared our concerns.

Thanks once again for your interest, Kim