Access to loans, grants, etc for 2nd time student

Mr_Crafty

Hi all,

My wife is going back to university in September and has been told that she is not eligible for a student loan. She's been to uni before, getting a 1st in Chemistry, but this was 10 years ago and she didn't take a loan while she was there. Also she lived in a different place then, under a different LEA.

We've also been told that we're not eligible for Child Tax Credit (we have 3 kids) - it seems that no finanial help is available to us at all.

Is this right? More to the point, is this accurate?

Ta very much

Torby

sounds a bit strange that she wont be getting any help....is there not some sort of bursary scheme available?

Mr_Crafty

No bursaries available in the department she's applying to (Optometry in Cardiff) as they don't have to offer them. They have loads of applicants for each place as they are the top school in the country.

Seems strange to me too......

DrFluffy

Yes it is correct. Student loans for second undergraduate degrees were stopped as of September 2006 - with the exception of some allied health professions, medicine, dentistry, vet med and architecture. If her first degree was not an honours degree, she might be ok...

DrFluffy

This: http://www.studentsupportdirect.co.uk/pls/portal/docs/PAGE/SPIPG001/SPIPS001/SPIPS008/S_FSHE_V6.PDF

Should tel you everything you need to know... Page 26 refers to people with a first degree...

However,
maintenance loans will continue to be available to students who do not already have an honours degree from a UK institution, and to students who
are on a course leading to a professional qualification in a number of areas, including medical doctor, dentist, veterinary doctor and architect.

Mr_Crafty

Cheers Dr Fluffy. Unfortunately, her first degree was an honours degree (Chemistry). And even though her new course will lead to her gaining a professional qualification, it doesn't seem to be on the list of allied health professions.

Mind you pharmacy doesn't seem to be on that list either which seems ridiculous.

Crispy_Ambulance

sorry to be the messenger of doom, but your wife needs to think very carefully if she can actually afford to do this course. Wanting to do a course and being able to afford to do it are not the same thing.

There is very little available for those doing a second degree and fees will have to be paid up front. the access to learning fund is unlikely to offer much help either.

she may be better to consider studying part time.

DrFluffy

Mr_Crafty wrote:

Cheers Dr Fluffy. Unfortunately, her first degree was an honours degree (Chemistry). And even though her new course will lead to her gaining a professional qualification, it doesn't seem to be on the list of allied health professions.

Mind you pharmacy doesn't seem to be on that list either which seems ridiculous.

Opthalmology and pharmacy are definitely not on the list - I know that from friends (well one friend and someone I 'know' from another forum!) in the first year of both programmes... Apparently it is 'due' to the high wages both professions attract (ironic really, given medics do not usually end up poor [although it is expensive to study], and don't get me started on dentists, although I realise that there is more to it than forcing them to work in the NHS for a given number of years!...)

There is a wealth of finance availble through charities for second first degreers... She needs to start looking in to that, and sit down with the EGAS hand book, and have a search on here, I've posted sources of income for second degreers before...

Mr_Crafty

Crispy, appreciate your advice. Obviously we've thought extensively about this before she's applied - she has her interview next month. You can't study optometry part-time so that's a non-starter I'm afraid. When she finishes her degree she will have a well-paid job, and all our kids will be in school so we'll be alright long-term. Which is why she would prefer to have a student loan than scrabble around looking for grants. On that point, I don't see why the Access to Learning grant should be inaccessible. What's it there for? Our childcare costs are more than any single bill for any other student would be.

Fluffy, opthalmology and optometry are slightly different things but I know where you're coming from. We are not looking for hand-outs necessarily, but as she didn't take her loan during her first degree I don't see why she shouldn't take be allowed to take it now. She'll be better able to pay it back than a sociology, media studies or even nursing student....

On a general note, I think it's pretty ridiculous that someone who got a 1st distinction in Chemistry with one of the top marks in the UK during her year is having to re-train 10 year later. We could go to the US and earn a fortune, but we want to stay here, despite the lack of support for families.

Crispy_Ambulance

Mr_Crafty wrote:

Crispy, appreciate your advice. Obviously we've thought extensively about this before she's applied - she has her interview next month. You can't study optometry part-time so that's a non-starter I'm afraid. When she finishes her degree she will have a well-paid job, and all our kids will be in school so we'll be alright long-term. Which is why she would prefer to have a student loan than scrabble around looking for grants. On that point, I don't see why the Access to Learning grant should be inaccessible. What's it there for? Our childcare costs are more than any single bill for any other student would be.

Fluffy, opthalmology and optometry are slightly different things but I know where you're coming from. We are not looking for hand-outs necessarily, but as she didn't take her loan during her first degree I don't see why she shouldn't take be allowed to take it now. She'll be better able to pay it back than a sociology, media studies or even nursing student....

On a general note, I think it's pretty ridiculous that someone who got a 1st distinction in Chemistry with one of the top marks in the UK during her year is having to re-train 10 year later. We could go to the US and earn a fortune, but we want to stay here, despite the lack of support for families.

whether you think it is fair or not, that is the law and there is no discretion. She will not be eligible for a fee loan or for a maintenance loan. So, you will have to find £3K per year to pay the fees. And then support yourselves. and the access to learning fund is not an "I'm skint" fund. They have set criteria of who and what they can support and some unis intepret this much more harshly than others.

Maybe she could do the course when your kids are older and your childcare costs will be less? There are grants around, but usually a few hundred quid here or there and you will usually have to show that your family income is low. And I mean low. Anyone starting a course for which there is little or no statutory funding available needs to think very carefully about it. The same goes for postgrad students - many of whom think that some fairies will come and pay their fees for them.

It may be worth looking at a professional studies loan, although it will depend on the bank and it will be a hefty amount to repay.

Mr_Crafty

We are in Wales so the fees won't be that much. I've gone through the studentsupportdirect website and put all her information in, including the fact that she has already done 3 years of higher education and it says she is entitled to £4500 maintenance grant. Have you got any reason to think this is wrong?

I've been through the Access to Learning Grant thread, started by someone who used to work in Student Finance, and there's no suggestion in that thread that she would not be entitled to something.

At present she earns about £20,000, as an optometrist she'd start at about £35,000. I can't really see the sense in delaying it as she'll be forty by the time she finishes at the moment. Surely maximising our earning potential is best. We just want a little help to do it.

Like I said, we've thought very carefully about this - it's the best option whether we get help or not. And working in a university as I do, with post-grad students, I can't say your "fairies will bail me out" theory rings true at all.