EDF and rejecting increase in writing

meherenow

Hi all, long time lurker here, but needing some help now!


Another EDF online saver 7 question, sorry!


I have acted quickly when the letter arrived indictating the mega price rise and emailed (and snail mailed) them the letter to say that I reject their price increase and I will be changing supplier.

Having sent a few emails trying to clarify that I will not be affected by a price increase as I have already started to move suppliers well within the time scale (and EDF then taking 2 to 3 weeks per reply) my supply is due to change tomorrow, I had this email a couple of weeks ago....


[FONT=&quot]"Thank you for your email dated 24 June 2011, and please accept our apologies for the late reply to your e-mail and for any inconvenience that has been caused by your query.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]After looking at your account we can advise you that if you were to change your supplier you would incur a Termination Fee of £30 as you agreed to our Online Saver Version 7 tariff. This tariff is a variable tariff and states in the Terms and Conditions that if there were to be a price increase you would incur this; however it states we will ensure that the Online S@ver Version 7 tariff unit rates are at least 2% less than our equivalent Standard tariff unit rate (excluding the Fixed Daily Charge which applies to the Online S@ver Version 7 tariff).[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]As above we can advise that your prices will change as per the price increase. If you did wish to change energy provider you would still incur the price increase.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]If you have any further questions or queries please contact us directly to discuss. Also if you do still dispute the above can you please also advise us of how or where you obtained this information?[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]If you have any further queries please do not hesitate to contact us either via our e-mail address [EMAIL="customerenquiries@edfenergy.com"]customerenquiries@edfenergy.com[/EMAIL][/FONT] or using the ‘contact us’ iconin My Account. Alternatively please call us on our free phone number 0800 096 9000. Our lines are open Monday to Friday 08:00 to 20:00 and Saturday 08:00 to 14:00.

[FONT=&quot]Kind Regards,"[/FONT]




This caused me to reply to confirm that OFGEM regulations say that I should not be affected by a price increase if I have notified them in writing and started the transfer and today I have had this email, reproduced below:



" Thank you for your e-mail dated 10 July 2011.

We are sorry to see you are leaving us with effect from 1 August 2011.

As previously advised, as per the terms and conditions you agreed to, you will incur an early termination fee of £30 as you have changed supplier before 31 December 2011. The terms and conditions also state the Online Saver Version 7 unit rates are guaranteed to be at least 2% less that our equivalent Standard tariff unit rates, however it is a variable tariff and may be affected by prices changes.

The Ofgem regulation you refer to applies to our Standard tariff only and when you agreed to the Online Saver Version 7 tariff you entered a formal supply agreement with EDF Energy and are bound to the terms and conditions of the Online Saver Version 7 tariff.

You will shortly receive your final Electricity bill.


Kind regards,"










Now I expect to pay the £30 get out clause, even though I read in other threads about people being let off with it, but is this customer service agent correct that I cannot reject the increase so I will be paying the higher rate from 14th July to 31st July? I quoted this to them: "According to an Ofgem regulation, customers are legally entitled to reject the price change up to 20 days after receiving notification by letter and to switch to a new energy supplier with a cheaper tariff."


Help!?!

macman

Their reply is nonsensical-if you reject the increase and commence a switch within 15 days, then they should not charge you the higher rate for the remainder of our contract.

backfoot

You can take it from me, who has it in writing from their commercial solicitor, that you won't be paying the termination fee either. They have waived it as a policy decision on OS7.

If they don't wake up, tell them you want deadlock letter and will be taking the matter to the Energy Ombudsman.

If they let it go to adjudication, come back to me and I will provide the evidence which will be highly embarrassing to the Customer Service Department.'

Kind regards' :rotfl:indeed.

I do , however, think that the 'EDF secret agent ' will be contacting you before very long.

meherenow

Yep, I thought so, in fact in my last email I told them that it did not matter one jot what their T&C said, I was entitled to reject the increase and not be subjected to the new tariff cost as I had started the transfer process within the time limit. Now the £30 is a different matter, but I'm on £15 cashback and a saving of £80ish for the next year anyway with Npower go fix 6.

How should I reply back? As I've said, I already told them they were mistaken in trying to charge me the new price rise despite a move having been instigated.



edit: just saw your reply too Backfoot. Many thanks! It has been your posts I have been following.

Here is what I wrote to them, by post and email, originally...


"[FONT=&quot]Following your letter dated "June 2011" which I have just received please regard this email as notice to you that I reject the price increase and that I am giving you required notice that I intend to switch suppliers.

I understand that in this scenario I will not incur the price rise quoted from 14th July 2011 while the transfer process is taking place.

Given that you intend to raise my tariff by over 20% I have also been advised that in this case I will not be charged an exit fee.

Please confirm your receipt of this correspondence.

Regards"


and this is the level of customer service I received back on this (over 2 weeks later):


"[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Thank you for your email dated 24 June 2011 and please accept my apologies for the late reply to your e-mail and for any inconvenience that has been caused by your query[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]I can confirm we have received your email and letter, I have also attached unit prices and terms and conditions of the online saver v7 tariff.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]If you have any further queries please do not hesitate to contact us either via our e-mail address [EMAIL="customerenquiries@edfenergy.com"]customerenquiries@edfenergy.com[/EMAIL] or using the ‘contact us’ iconin My Account. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Alternatively please call us on our free phone number 0800 096 9000. Our lines are open Monday to Friday 8:00 to 20:00 and Saturday 8:00 to 14:00.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Kind regards"[/FONT]



I would be crying about this customer service if it weren't so laughable! Er, many thanks for not really answering my query!

backfoot

Say that you have been informed by the EDf Legal Department and Kerry Butler in Customer Service that EDF have waived termination fees as a policy decision on OS7.

I would also personally be asking why the person dealing with you has not been properly trained or briefed on the matter. (but that's an optional extra).:D

meherenow

Here is my reply to them that prompted todays email - now I sent this on 10th July so that is 3 weeks to get back to me!

"FORMAL COMPLAINT
Further to your correspondence which I reproduce below, I have already advised you that I REJECT your latest price increase and that I am moving supplier.

According to an Ofgem regulation, customers are legally entitled to reject the price change up to 20 days after receiving notification by letter and to switch to a new energy supplier with a cheaper tariff.

As such your communication to me below is incorrect and I would advise you, again, that I reject the price increase as notified and I am moving to a new supplier. As such you are obliged to keep my tariff prices the same as current values by Ofgem regulation. It matters not what your Terms & Conditions say regarding variable rates, as any price rise is still covered by these Ofgem rules which of course supersede any Terms & Conditions. As I have already put into place the transfer process within the set timeline you are obliged by Ofgem rules to freeze my tariff prices and NOT increase them until the transfer has gone through.

As to your termination fee of £30 that your terms and conditions say I “may” be charged (not that I “would” be charged as per your email) - I have it on good authority that your own legal department is advising that “no one wishing to change supplier due to the price increase on the OSV7 will be charged the termination fees.” Perhaps you can validate this information with your legal department before getting back to me.



Regards"



and that reply again, for easy reading...


" Thank you for your e-mail dated 10 July 2011.

We are sorry to see you are leaving us with effect from 1 August 2011.

As previously advised, as per the terms and conditions you agreed to, you will incur an early termination fee of £30 as you have changed supplier before 31 December 2011. The terms and conditions also state the Online Saver Version 7 unit rates are guaranteed to be at least 2% less that our equivalent Standard tariff unit rates, however it is a variable tariff and may be affected by prices changes.

The Ofgem regulation you refer to applies to our Standard tariff only and when you agreed to the Online Saver Version 7 tariff you entered a formal supply agreement with EDF Energy and are bound to the terms and conditions of the Online Saver Version 7 tariff.

You will shortly receive your final Electricity bill.


Kind regards,"





So it would seem that this latest customer agent did not check with her legal department, despite me labelling this email a formal complaint.


I'll try to quote the name you give me, but I reckon if it's another 3 weeks for a reply then they'll be off with my money from the direct debit anyway!

backfoot

meherenow wrote: »

[FONT=&quot]and this is the level of customer service I received back on this (over 2 weeks later):[/FONT]


[FONT=&quot]"[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Thank you for your email dated 24 June 2011 and please accept my apologies for the late reply to your e-mail and for any inconvenience that has been caused by your query[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]I can confirm we have received your email and letter, I have also attached unit prices and terms and conditions of the online saver v7 tariff.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]If you have any further queries please do not hesitate to contact us either via our e-mail address [EMAIL="customerenquiries@edfenergy.com"]customerenquiries@edfenergy.com[/EMAIL] or using the ‘contact us’ iconin My Account. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Alternatively please call us on our free phone number 0800 096 9000. Our lines are open Monday to Friday 8:00 to 20:00 and Saturday 8:00 to 14:00.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Kind regards"[/FONT]

I would be crying about this customer service if it weren't so laughable! Er, many thanks for not really answering my query!

Yes it up there with the most wonderfully pitiful responses. Sadly, it's not alone,

I think the last bit they have sent is a typo and should read :

'Kind regards xxxxx '

meherenow

backfoot wrote: »

I would also personally be asking why the person dealing with you has not been properly trained or briefed on the matter. (but that's an optional extra).:D

LOL, I will definately be asking why everyone is not on the same message - in fact ANYONE, as I now have 3 email replies from 3 different people, and probably another from someone else when I repeat myself again in a new email!

jalexa

meherenow wrote: »

I quoted this to them: "According to an Ofgem regulation, customers are legally entitled to reject the price change up to 20 days after receiving notification by letter and to switch to a new energy supplier with a cheaper tariff."


Help!?!

This is much more of a tactical issue than a legal issue. You have very well informed and considered opinion from at least 1 poster. Equally one or other of the Edf emails mentions (and explains) a particular interpretation of the regulations as you have tried to explain a different interpretation. Incidently if you have been following this topic, a MSE article author has articulated the Edf interpretation as Ofgem's interpretation.

FWIW, and its not relevant to this reply, I am not convinced by the MSE article author's explanation of Ofgem's "interpretation".

Anyway back to tactics. Possibly you already know this, but my advice is keep focussed, calmly raise your formal complaint strictly in accordance with the Edf complaints policy, clear stating your demand, with the briefest of reference to the regulations. Invite Edf to concede or declare "deadlock", and at "deadlock" or 8 weeks after first raising the issue, ask the Energy Ombudsman to consider the issue.

BTW I cannot give comfort that the Energy Ombudsman will definitely uphold your complaint, clearly there are differing interpretations doing the rounds, but this forum has posts that suggest British Gas and Scottish Power are not sufficiently confident to risk a challenge. The Energy Ombudsman referral will cost you nothing (well possibly the £30 early termination fee), but (I believe) Edf win or lose will incur a hefty case fee. Justice of sorts.

Edf would be stupid to allow this to go to the Energy Ombudsman. Unfortunately I cannot say Edf is not stupid.

Meanwhile focus 100% on your switch and do not allow this to consume your life.

meherenow

jalexa wrote: »

This is much more of a tactical issue than a legal issue. You have very well informed and considered opinion from at least 1 poster. Equally one or other of the Edf emails mentions (and explains) a particular interpretation of the regulations as you have tried to explain a different interpretation. Incidently if you have been following this topic, a MSE article author has articulated the Edf interpretation as Ofgem's interpretation.

FWIW, and its not relevant to this reply, I am not convinced by the MSE article author's explanation of Ofgem's "interpretation".

Anyway back to tactics. Possibly you already know this, but my advice is keep it focussed, calmly raise your formal complaint strictly in accordance with the Edf complaints policy, clear stating your demand, with the briefest of reference to the regulations. Invite Edf to concede or declare "deadlock", and at "deadlock" or 8 weeks after first raising the issue, ask the Energy Ombudsman to consider the issue.

BTW I cannot give comfort that the Energy Ombudsman will uphold your complaint, clearly there are differing interpretations doing the rounds, but this forum has posts that suggest British Gas and Scottish Power are not sufficiently confident to risk a challenge. The Energy Ombudsman referral will cost you nothing (well possibly the £30 early termination fee), but (I believe) Edf, win or lose, will incur a hefty case fee.

Edf would be stupid to allow this to go to the Energy Ombudsman. Unfortunately I cannot say Edf is not stupid.

Meanwhile focus 100% on your switch and do not allow this to consume your life.

OK, thanks for the info - don't worry I won't let it consume me (not at the rate of 1 reply every 3 weeks anyway!).

Now, just to clarify - the £30 termination fee I realise is a bit of a gamble - BUT, I just want to be sure I am reading the regulation correctly - as I have started a move and informed them in writing, they definately CANNOT put my tariff prices up (and I realise this is only gonna be worth a few pounds really seeing as I start my new contract tomorrow according to EDF, so only 2 weeks I am looking to save)?

But is that right, forget the £30 termination fee for a minute - they are putting my prices up and that means I can, and have, rejected them so my old tariff prices remain in force until I move supplier?

jalexa

meherenow wrote: »

I just want to be sure I am reading the regulation correctly - as I have started a move and informed them in writing, they definately CANNOT put my tariff prices up ....

...But is that right, forget the £30 termination fee for a minute - they are putting my prices up and that means I can, and have, rejected them so my old tariff prices remain in force until I move supplier?

I don't think *anybody* (even Edf) disagrees with that.