Sales of Goods Act - Will this be covered??

MrsLB

Hi everyone! I'm a newbie to the forums but have been a fan of MSE for years... and now I really need some advice before I take this matter further!

My company purchased some machinery which cost us £25,000. This wasn't entered into lightly, research was done as to whether this machine would work or not and we were assured by the seller that it would. It had to be paid for up front which it was. When it arrived, some vital components were missing, one of which we had to replace and one that the company sorted out.

After installation and tests etc. we were reasonably satisfied with it and started using it. However, after a few months it became apparent that this machine was not capable of the job in hand at all. We contacted them in May (3 months after it was 'commissioned') stating that we weren't happy with it and asked them for some solutions - nothing was received.

Anyway, to cut a long story short, we emailed them several times and received wishy-washy responses and last week I had an independent expert come to view the machine who said that it would never work to the capacity which we require and basically, we have been mis-sold this equipment. On 14 July I asked to receive a formal proposal and response with a view to seeking the removal and refund of the machine by 29 July and I have had nothing back from them. To say they are arrogant is an understatement and I feel that they just don't care.

We have reinstated our old piece of machinery (which luckily we kept) and it has knocked the socks off this thing we have been stitched up with.

So, as this machine doesn't do what it's meant to whatsoever, can we throw the Sales of Goods Act at them in order to make them wake up and listen? I'd like to try this route first before going to see a solicitor as that could get very expensive!

Any tips or help would be grately appreciated!

Many thanks,
Mrs LB

crazyguy

From my knowledge dealing with suppliers I would say that the legal route is your only option here.

Could be worth while writing them a formal letter stating that you intend to take legal action against them unless they look to resolve the situation for you, give them 7-14 days to reply in fulll, if you go down the legal route it will be expensive on that figure anyway, solicitor, court cost's will soon mount up.

dreamypuma

Is it fair to assume that this machine is being used by you in the line of business?

bris

SOGA deals mostly with consumers so as a business to business transaction it won't really help you. I can see a problen with the fact you have used it happily for a few months, this would be a good indication that you have accepted it. If the company that sold it to you refuse to accept liability, and I can see why they would after a few months, then you would need to go to court to prove they lied about it's capacity to you. This would be expensive with no guarentee you would win.
Do you have anything in writing to say it would do what they said it would? If not it's your word against their's and I can't see you winning on this basis.
It looks like you will have to see a solicitor to settle this.

MrsLB

The machine WAS being used by us in the line of business, however, we had concerns for a number of reasons which we outlined to them from the start and also, it had to be used for a few months to gauage its performance - it was not something you could just switch on and see instant results. It then became apparent that it was not performing well and we contacted them in May. Yes, I feel they have lied to us and this is not just a few quid, it's £25,000!!! Also, this was a reconditioned machine, not brand new stock and I have since found out that it was made in 1976 and should be worth no more than £9000, nowhere near what we paid for it!

wealdroam

With a business to business transaction, it is possible to agree that some parts of the Sale of Goods Act do not apply.

Without knowing exactly what you have agreed to, it is very difficult to advise further.

By the way, I am fascinated to see how the thing has deteriorated in such a short period of time...
1) After installation and tests etc. we were reasonably satisfied with it.
2) after a few months it became apparent that this machine was not capable of the job in hand at all.
3) So, as this machine doesn't do what it's meant to whatsoever...

The point you make about having paid nearly three times the value of the thing, is something that you should have established when you did your reseach before purchase.

Did you buy a brand new machine and receive a reconditioned one?
Or did you buy a reconditioned one and are now surprised at how old it is?

MrsLB

I wouldn't say the machine had deteriorated, from further research and an independent expert on such things, it wasn't capable of what we wanted in the first place, however we were assured it was by the seller. We bought a reconditioned machine and we knew that. Basically, we use a chemical that we need to clean (to remove paint particles) once it's been used and this machine was meant to do that, but it doesn't! Thanks for all your help and replies - I'll be going to CAB firstly and then to a solicitor.

pinkshoes

When purchasing the machine, did you give a specification to the company of what you required it to do? (i.e. a formal document outlining the machine spec and requirements).

Can the machine be modified to make it work at the correct capacity?

Were the company who sold it involved in the commissioning of the machine?

MrsLB

Yes, they were well aware of the requirements, we made a site visit to their factory, but the machine we were expecting wasn't available at the time of the visit. We and the company have tried every possible eventuality to get it to work as it should, but to no avail, it is just not capable of doing the job! And yes, they were the ones who commissioned it...

pinkshoes

MrsLB wrote: »

Yes, they were well aware of the requirements

But is this in the form of a document, detailing what the machine needed to do, with a specific mention of capacity?

If yes, then you can take them to court to get your money back, so I'd send them a "letter before action", giving them 21 days to collect the machine and refund you £25000. (Give details in the letter of why you're rejecting it as not fit for purpose).

If you don't hear anything in 21 days, then take them to court.

Optimist

MrsLB wrote: »

I wouldn't say the machine had deteriorated, from further research and an independent expert on such things, it wasn't capable of what we wanted in the first place, however we were assured it was by the seller. We bought a reconditioned machine and we knew that. Basically, we use a chemical that we need to clean (to remove paint particles) once it's been used and this machine was meant to do that, but it doesn't! Thanks for all your help and replies - I'll be going to CAB firstly and then to a solicitor.

CAB will not be interested they do not deal with business problems. You have spent £25k on this machine, spend another £150 odd on a solicitor for proper advice.

I am sorry not to be more help but the law is complex and this is well out of line for small claims action. There is a old adage in the legal profession that goes "a person who represents themselves has a fool for a client." This is particularly true when you leave the small claims environment.