The Rising Cost of Food

3v3

goodgodthatonesevenbigger wrote: »

In regards to Allotments, is there not a way to push the government or local Authority to provide more? Surly there is a demand for an increased number of sites?

While I would never discourage anyone from lobbying for change, the major issue with "land" is (and, please forgive me for not recalling who famously said it) "they ain't making any more of it"! Despite the demand, the supply is lacking. There is just as much of a demand for housing as there is for arable land (probably more so).

However, do not be discouraged: there is still a good number of things which can be grown on a windowsill (sproutings seeds) or a balcony in grow bags.

I think the most important thing is, to educate people on what can be grown in the smallest of inches, with the greatest of benefit. and ranging to the more generous spot.

For those who are fortunate enough to have relations within reach and with some soil to spare, it's a case of harnessing that advantage.

For those without relations, or the space for a full blown allotment - even a washing up bowl can provide a long lasting salad crop from a shop bought "living salad" plant - with the right "know-how":)

3v3

Going4TheDream wrote: »

l

I am sure it was Hugh F Whittingstall who got involved with or started
'Landshare' where like minded people can find land to grow or give land for others to grow on etc, its still in its early days but might be worth a look

I have mixed feelings about this (to be honest; not controversial) On the one hand, I think it is an excellant idea! But, by that same token, it involves a huge amount of "trust". For example, a year ago I moved from a pocket hankerchief garden to a lively 1/4 acre. I have given due thought to "opening" my personal space to like minded others. However, the shift patterns of my family, the practicalities of having sections of my garden, free house, does give me pause for thought and I'm not sure that I would feel comfortable with people utilising my space (probably due to knowing too much about liars/fraudsters/opportunists; which, I freely admit, colours my judgement and leaves me a tad biased?)

The problem with the concept of "like minded others" always reminds me that "opportunists" present themselves as like-minded-others but with a differing agenda! (Cue post: "I opened up my garden for a "Land-share" and then my house was burgled" ... imagine the responses

ceridwen

3v3 wrote: »

While I would never discourage anyone from lobbying for change, the major issue with "land" is (and, please forgive me for not recalling who famously said it) "they ain't making any more of it"! Despite the demand, the supply is lacking. There is just as much of a demand for housing as there is for arable land (probably more so).

However, do not be discouraged: there is still a good number of things which can be grown on a windowsill (sproutings seeds) or a balcony in grow bags.

I think the most important thing is, to educate people on what can be grown in the smallest of inches, with the greatest of benefit. and ranging to the more generous spot.

For those who are fortunate enough to have relations within reach and with some soil to spare, it's a case of harnessing that advantage.

For those without relations, or the space for a full blown allotment - even a washing up bowl can provide a long lasting salad crop from a shop bought "living salad" plant - with the right "know-how":)

Some valid points there:

- certainly I think people who've got even a pathetically tiny bit of land (ie matchbox garden/balcony/yard) shouldnt give up trying and grow what they can and make maximum utilisation of what space there is available on the one hand

- on the other hand I think its good for people to lobby LONG and HARD for allotments - because The Other Side (ie developers and those wanting to build extra roads) are certainly lobbying hard to grab for a lot of our "green space". So we have to lobby at least as hard back - if only to keep the balance - and hopefully to slant it towards us. There are STILL existing allotments being grabbed and built on - so obviously we arent yet lobbying hard enough to stop this.

EDIT: and re your post on whether it would be "like-minded others" or "nasties" pretending to be "like-minded others" in order to get a foot in the door looking for opportunities for no-gooding..

I dont think we can start from that viewpoint - there will always be ne'er do wells in anything (and I've encountered a thief in a "good cause" group I was in before now - in fact, as far as I know, was the first one to suspect him of being that sort of person). However - there is a much much higher percentage of decent/normal (maybe even downright altruistic and High Giver type people) in this type of venture than one finds generally. So - I've never heard of thieving/etc taking place in this type of scheme to date - so I would say its rare and peeps shouldnt be put off from trying because of the very occasional thief/etc that might even wander into these groups. If one bears in mind how much nicer/more honest the vast majority of people in these groups are than one usually finds elsewhere - then I would say it more than counterbalances.

Its easier for younger people to make errors of judgement re peoples character - but one advantage of having made a lot of "character misjudgements" over the years (and I've certainly made some lulus...) is one comes to a point in one's life where you can pretty much spot "a wrong 'un" before they even open their mouth - so I would imagine you would have picked up how to spot them by now and could avoid inadvertently "taking one on board".

GreyQueen

Morning all.

Just nipping in after reading the last two pages and I'd like to say as an experienced veg grower (taught by Dad and Grandad, from an unbroken line of English peasantry) that this has been a very very difficult year weatherwise, and the veggies have suffered a lot.

Worst drought in my part of England for over 100 years and lots of other record breakers. So, if you're a newbie or relative newbie, please don't assume that this is the norm and that you can't get good crops. I'd hate for people to throw in the towel over what is a freak year.

We have had some banditry on our lottie site in recent years; one old boy had left 2 rows of tatties in the ground (tops off) until he could get to dig them and someone had them up and away overnight. Must have had a wheelbarrow or a car as there would've been a sackful. Left a pretty sick feeling for all of us.

Re allotments being totally unavailable, I'm sure there's some statutory duty to provide them laid down on parish councils and local authorities. Perhaps interested parties would like to look at the website of the National Association of Allotment and Leisure Gardeners.

PS You can stock up on sugar almost indefinately as it doesn't go off but oils have a use-by date for a good reason (they go rancid) so always pay attention to that. I was stocking -up on oils earlier this year (spring) and the use-bys were for summer 2012. HTH.

Flibsey

I grow a little, but not enough to sustain a family. what's anoyed me most this week is I have been trying incredibly hard to get all of our food in for under £60, and then husband went back to work and instead of taking food I'd bought for him to take, he went to flipping asda on the way into work and got himself a week's worth of lunch stuff to keep at work. he spent nearly a tenner and has thrown off my flipping budget.

I am also teaching my daughter how to be frugal with food and how to cook. she's 5. never too young for instance, yesterday we were going through the carrots in the fridge. they had some black marks around them where they'd just begun to "go". cut these off and they're fine, rot is stopped and they will last at least another week.

Uniscots97

I think a lot of manufacturers are starting to cotton on to the fact more people are taking packed lunches with them. I was in the supermarket yesterday and saw H***z new range of packed lunch soups. They come in a small plastic pouch (not dissimilar to hot chocolate sachets) and they were charging 75p for this sachet. Instructions on the packet read, tear open, pour into a cup and microwave. The serving was miniscule. It wasn't even half of what a normal tin is. The big brands obviously know there are people out there that can't cook yet want to try and save money and this is their answer. .....Oh dear. I'd rather make a pot of homemade soup and portion it up, far cheaper and much better for you.

Going4TheDream

3v3 wrote: »

I have mixed feelings about this (to be honest; not controversial) On the one hand, I think it is an excellant idea! But, by that same token, it involves a huge amount of "trust". For example, a year ago I moved from a pocket hankerchief garden to a lively 1/4 acre. I have given due thought to "opening" my personal space to like minded others. However, the shift patterns of my family, the practicalities of having sections of my garden, free house, does give me pause for thought and I'm not sure that I would feel comfortable with people utilising my space (probably due to knowing too much about liars/fraudsters/opportunists; which, I freely admit, colours my judgement and leaves me a tad biased?)

The problem with the concept of "like minded others" always reminds me that "opportunists" present themselves as like-minded-others but with a differing agenda! (Cue post: "I opened up my garden for a "Land-share" and then my house was burgled" ... imagine the responses

Yes I do agree to a point and this isn't for everyone. I am not sure that I would want to allow someone access to my personal garden, but if I had a piece of land that I wasn't using all off away from my house I wouldn't be adverse to the idea in principal of allowing someone to use part of it for growing food. I suppose its a bit like renting out a property, albeit different if that makes sense!! as as far as I am aware its recommended that its all done quite formally once you had the initials chats on it with the concerned parties, along with it being recommended people make formal agreements, agree on terms etc.

Its a shame though that one bad apple so to speak could really blight what on the face of it is a fantastic idea even if there had been hundreds of successful matches. I am sure that the number of bad people is tiny compared to the number of genuine people in any situation. Its a possible solution for those looking for land to grow, and like anything only when truly evaluated and looked into will either the land offerer or the person looking decide if its for them or not....

valk_scot

Once again, it's all down to education. We're a developed country after all and food is not in short supply, also most people (yes I know it's not 100%) can afford to feed themselves. The thing is that people want to be able to buy the food they've become used to expecting and this, a lot of the time nowadays, means pre prepared or processed or convenient. Every time something happens to a food item...like putting a wrapper on it, or cutting it up, or making it into something else it adds to the price of the item. A lot of these costs can be bypassed if you know how to prepare a particular food or meal from raw or minimally processed ingredients, but fewer and fewer people seem to know how to do this.

Yes, I know that's what old style is all about but we're in a minority I think. How many cookery programs or latest trendy cookery books tells you how to joint a chicken or make basic stock, or inexpensive home baking or everyday bread or even how to prepare a carrot for different purposes? There's no money in it for the TV company or publisher or celebrity cook and certainly not for the supermarkets, so the information just isn't out there in the public eye, not like the heavily advertised supermarket processed stuff. It's all very well saying the schools should do this but you're only talking about a few years here and it's not even the time of your life that it's that useful. How about the rest of the time? Hence me saying we need to get back to some sort of public education/Ministry of Food type program. The mainstream food industry would fight it tooth and nail of course because there's no money in it for them, quite the opposite. But untill it's done most people are utterly at the mercy of the big food companies and their price rises because they have no idea how to feed themselves any other way.

euronorris

slowlyfading wrote: »

I'm 24, and when I did food tech at school (and not everyone picked it as an option) i didn't really learn about cooking anything valuable at all. In fact, half of the year was a project on a cake (I picked carrot cake) and we had to make different variations of the same cake for 24 weeks in a row. Thrilling.

My God, you can't help but ask 'What was the point of that??' in that situation.

I'm only 28 myself, and I had no food tech lessons at school. It wasn't offered at all.

My Mum isn't exactly the best cook in the world either. It was always basic stuff, or stews and the veg was often boiled to oblivion! Thankfully, my eldest brother did some chef training when he was working for Beefeater many years ago, and he passed that knowledge onto my other brother, and he in turn passed on some of it to me.

That was enough to get me trying and experimenting, and generally peak my interest and I've taken it from there.

My OH's Mum didn't teach him or his brother how to cook though. Not even how to boil an egg (I kid you not!)!! I only found that out a few months ago. I assumed that he knew some of the basic stuff as he can make a chicken stirfry, but that was only because his ex taught him. So, he's now on a learning curve too. And, I know from this experience, that there is a certain reluctance to try for fear of messing it up, as I have had to coax OH into it and assure him that it doesn't matter. I use his favourite scientific saying, along the lines 'no experiement is a failure, as it will always teach you something'.

Candy53

lollyfin wrote: »

I am teaching my kids how to knit and they know about shopping wisely and cooking
i am teaching myself how to crochet and use a sewing machine and will pass those skills on as well ( once i know what im doing!)
my eldest daughter is a chef and is surprised by things other chefs do or ask, these people have been to college , one asked her if you put water iin scrambled eggs he was second chef! and the amount of waste in the kitchens is unbelievable. I did ask her if the staff got to take food home or was it given to homeless charities or something but she said no it is just put in the bin. I think that is a disgrace but i think the same anout supermarkets throwing stuff in the bin as well

My son trained to be a chef at college. By the time he had reached his last year, things had changed so much because of the health and safety laws.

At his college, they all had to cook for the in house restaraunt, which was for the public. Him, and all of the students, were shocked at how much food they had to throw away. I asked him why they didn't give it to the hospitals, but he said they wern't allowed incase people got food poisoning. The tutors used to let the students have some, but are told now that is is strictly forbidden. Even the tutors were always angry at the waste.

Regarding allotments, my brother and wife live in a village, and haven't enough room in the garden to grow veg.
Lots of land surrounding the village, but of course it all belongs to farmers. They had to get on the list for an allotment, in the nearest town, and it was 10 years before one came up.

Candy