Vodafone charged me more than £2000.00 for calls made on stolen phone!!!

NFH

Naf wrote: »

Secondly, mobile phone contracts are a credit agreement and therefore, technically, have a credit limit.

Really? I understood they were simply an agreement whereby services are billed in arrears. If they were a credit agreement, they would be governed by the Consumer Credit Act 1974, which I don't believe is the case. Any credit limit imposed by a mobile phone network is not like a credit card but more similar to an Amex charge card, whereby there is an internal limit that is not routinely divulged to customers. Although the mobile networks carry out credit checks, this does not imply a credit agreement either, as credit checks are carried out by many organisations for non-credit purposes including by employers upon prospective employees.

wantmemoney

goldenbat666 wrote:

The itemised bills showed incessant calls made to France, Africa and a few UK numbers

post the numbers here...the UK numbers should at least be traceable

Naf

NFH wrote: »

Really? I understood they were simply an agreement whereby services are billed in arrears. If they were a credit agreement, they would be governed by the Consumer Credit Act 1974, which I don't believe is the case. Any credit limit imposed by a mobile phone network is not like a credit card but more similar to an Amex charge card, whereby there is an internal limit that is not routinely divulged to customers. Although the mobile networks carry out credit checks, this does not imply a credit agreement either, as credit checks are carried out by many organisations for non-credit purposes including by employers upon prospective employees.

Just going by what I remember from the episode of 'Don't Get Done Get Dom'.
The episode was Series 5 Episode 6; an older chap had been using internet radio on his phone, but it didn't disconnect when he closed it, and when he left the house it continued using loads of data even when he disconnected from his home network. When Dom investigated he discovered that everyone has a type of credit limit even on mobile phone contracts, just the networks don't bother to police it. Ofcom believe they should. Unfortunately episodes don't seem to be available on iPlayer and I don't know anywhere else you can watch online.
Series 4 Episode 2 also seems to have a similar story that might be useful.

essexman77

Yes vodaphone should have niped this in the Bud sooner dont know how long you have been with them but going from say a 50 pound month bill to 1000s should be spotted on a system.

The person even if caught with your phone is not likely to get convicted for phones calls so no point tracing the numbers.Would vodaphone be likely to take you to court for the calls unlikely depends if you want to also wreck your credit rating.

I think most sensible phone operaters should use maybe 300 limit as starters and increase if your someone who breaks this limit a lot.All ican say thank goodness for Paygo which is why I never go contract more hassle than its worth.

goldenbat666

Firstly, thank you so much everyone for your advices.

You've all pointed out issues that I hadn't even thought of, so now I have a clearer picture as to where I stand.

To answer some of your questions as to when the calls were made, they started from early morning on Sunday 19th May (between 5-6am and hence, why I think it must have been stolen on my way back home that night) and ended on the following Tuesday late night, which is when I notified Vodafone after realising it had been stolen.

While I do fully appreciate that I may have been negligent in allowing my phone to be stolen and abused, the stolen phone was on a 25.00 tariff and so in all reasonableness, I feel a flag of some sort could and should have been raised before the bill hit anywhere near the ￡2,000 mark, especially considering the credit limit issue brought into light by Naf on this forum.

I have actually been a very loyal customer of Vodafone for 7 years now, since I started to use their services in secondary school. Since then I have never missed a single payment as it was set up on direct debit (which incidentally helped my credit rating).

But now, all my services have been restricted owing to this huge bill and it seems I can't even call the usual 191 number to make a payment; I've tried to pay a part of the bill using the usual automated service and the system keeps saying 'we'll put you through' just to hang up on me. I don't know if this is some sort of system overload manifesting itself?!

I've also tried to pay at least ￡100 via their website and although I got a page saying 'this functionality is unavailable', I did receive a separate email afterwards that seemed to confirm my payment so I guess I at least settled that small proportion of the bill... My phone's still blocked though.

Since I had a 9am-9pm day today, I wasn't able to call Vodafone by my home landline but I guess that's the only option I have left to explore since I highly doubt they will give me back the service until I clear all the overdue bill otherwise. Thank God, at least I know about saynoto0870.com through MSE so I won't be charged with yet another kind of unwelcome charges!

Would it be worth getting Ofcom involved in this matter? I did find an article on This is Money that seems to describe a very similar situation in that the lady wasn't able to notify the service provider straightaway and was charged with all the international calls made meanwhile (search for 'bill for a stolen phone' at: This is Money)

I'm not sure if this would help me though, since this was 5 years ago?

gjchester

goldenbat666 wrote: »

While I do fully appreciate that I may have been negligent in allowing my phone to be stolen and abused, the stolen phone was on a 25.00 tariff and so in all reasonableness, I feel a flag of some sort could and should have been raised before the bill hit anywhere near the ￡2,000 mark, especially considering the credit limit issue brought into light by Naf on this forum.

What would they have done, Called the phone and said were you aware of this, in which case the thief may have said OK and continued.

Networks have millions of accounts they can't monitor them all in real time. Another view is what happens if this had been you and you had a sick relative abroad, if that was your only menas of contract and they cut you off you'd be pretty hissed off with the network, they just can't win in cases like this.

goldenbat666 wrote: »

Would it be worth getting Ofcom involved in this matter? I did find an article on This is Money that seems to describe a very similar situation in that the lady wasn't able to notify the service provider straightaway and was charged with all the international calls made meanwhile (search for 'bill for a stolen phone' at: This is Money)

I'm not sure if this would help me though, since this was 5 years ago?

Sorry I know this sounds harsh but your phone had the ability to lock it and the sim card to prevent unauthorised calls, you didn't use it and you are negligent.

If it had been pin coded whoever stole it would not have been able to make calls, You also left it two days from losing the phone to calling the network, you should have called as soon as you realised it was lost.

I know it sounds not to be the case here but the rules exist as people have run up bills then claimed the phone was lost, thats why you are responsible till the phone is reported lost.

I know this is not what you want to hear but it happens a lot on here, and there were simple steps you could have taken to mitigate the loss.

wantmemoney

it's was the Networks that wanted phone accounts to be exempt from the same FSA regulations that credit/debit cards are subject to.

its time the Government got a grip of this irresponsible mob and made the phone accounts the same as credit/debit cards

ps @goldenbat666 I would still post the numbers that were called

NFH

wantmemoney wrote: »

its time the Government got a grip of this irresponsible mob and made the phone accounts the same as credit/debit cards

How would that work? And why should mobile phone services be subject to regulation as a financial service when other services similarly billed in arrears are not?

Naf

goldenbat666 wrote: »

To answer some of your questions as to when the calls were made, they started from early morning on Sunday 19th May (between 5-6am and hence, why I think it must have been stolen on my way back home that night) and ended on the following Tuesday late night, which is when I notified Vodafone after realising it had been stolen.

Unfortunately this does mean you can be held fully liable for all the calls that were made; they were all before you made Vodafone aware.

goldenbat666 wrote: »

While I do fully appreciate that I may have been negligent in allowing my phone to be stolen and abused, the stolen phone was on a 25.00 tariff and so in all reasonableness, I feel a flag of some sort could and should have been raised before the bill hit anywhere near the ￡2,000 mark, especially considering the credit limit issue brought into light by Naf on this forum.

It's not technically a credit limit in the same sense as a credit card, at least its not treated as such. Its a theoretical limit the network applies on your account based on their credit assessment of you, but is rarely, if ever, enforced. Its just an avenue I remembered that you could try pursuing.

gjchester wrote: »

What would they have done, Called the phone and said were you aware of this, in which case the thief may have said OK and continued.

gjchester wrote: »

Another view is what happens if this had been you and you had a sick relative abroad, if that was your only menas of contract and they cut you off you'd be pretty hissed off with the network, they just can't win in cases like this.

No, like a credit card they can cap your usage, and if you want to continue using it all you have to do is make a quick call to customer services (no problem on vodafone as their customer service is open 24/7).

gjchester wrote: »

Networks have millions of accounts they can't monitor them all in real time.

Credit card companies manage... somehow. I can only assume they find this very difficult? Not.

NFH wrote: »

How would that work? And why should mobile phone services be subject to regulation as a financial service when other services similarly billed in arrears are not?

Turn that round, why should credit cards be subject to regulation when they are just another account that's billed in arrears? I'm not saying I think credit cards shouldnt, just that it should be applied to all or none.

NFH

Naf wrote: »

Turn that round, why should credit cards be subject to regulation when they are just another account that's billed in arrears?

Because credit cards are a means of credit, i.e. a loan with an associated interest rate and a way of borrowing money. Contrast credit cards with charge cards (e.g. many American Express cards), which have no interest rate and require the amount to be paid in full every month, like mobile phone contracts, and which likewise are not subject to the Consumer Credit Act 1974 (including its useful Section 75).