Solar Panel Guide Discussion

zeupater

Cardew wrote: »

.... I believe that the reasoning(no idea if it is a reasonable assumption) behind fitting a lower rated inverter is that they are more efficient. So what you lose on the rare ocassions the panels generate in excess of the rated capacity of the inverter is more than compensated by a slighly higher efficiency for the great majority of the time ....

Hi

If you look at the performance curves for different inverters in the same range you'll probably come to the same conclusion as me .... it's all/mainly about price-point & margin .... there are probably even some manufacturers who build one product and supply as two models with very slight differences, most likely software .

HTH
Z

thenudeone

zeupater wrote: »

there are probably even some manufacturers who build one product and supply as two models with very slight differences, most likely software .

The Fronius Technical Support department has told me that this is exactly what they do. The only difference between an IG TL 3.0, 3.6 and 4.0 is the software. The 3.6 model is actually rated as 16A which is the maximum permissible connection without obtaining the network distributors' permission in advance (under the G83 procedure).
My 4kW panel array only very rarely approaches the 3.68kW limit of my inverter, so the loss of generation is miniscule.

John_Pierpoint

digitaltoast wrote: »

Me too - so why has it vanished? I've PM'd a mod who can shed some light onto why an interesting and useful post with so many reccs has vanished.

It is ridiculous - right from the start the poster "PendragonUK" said don't bother to contact me, we only do local authority work.
That is not spam.

I don't suppose anyone has got a copy of the posting?

There still is a pendragonUK (with a small P).

http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?p=26438613

I have checked with Google, unfortunately Google no longer cashe's everything. It is the poster rather than the posting that has been zapped - I wonder what that was all about?!?

Baby and bath water comes to mind.

Cardew

As it was such a useful post for potential customers, I wonder if some other firm's representatives haven't got it zapped!!

Freepost

John_Pierpoint wrote: »

It is ridiculous - right from the start the poster "PendragonUK" said don't bother to contact me, we only do local authority work.
That is not spam.

I don't suppose anyone has got a copy of the posting?

I've tried to recover the page without success. The best I can do is to compile the 5 of the bullet points and Pendragon's conclusion on Price/cost; If you think they are useful make a copy of them they may be deleted!

Originally Posted by PendragonUK
ADVICE FROM THE INSIDE:

9. Do you want a smart meter? - If you are likely to use more than 50% of the electric you generate then NO you don't you just want a cheap and cheerful generation meter, otherwise then yes you do. In any event you want telemetric (a sim card in the generation meter) monitoring that you can have on your home computer. This can be directly (cost say £5 a month in texts + one off software cost) or via a web portal (cost say £12 month including warning e-mails). The reason for this is if you don't generate you don't get paid your FIT and if your system stops working how do you know if it is not being monitored!

10. Ask what the panel and inverter make is and how they system is designed or selected to ensure best inverter match and size is chosen. The design ideally should have the inverter running about 115-120% at peak (July/August) and at 80-90% during the cold months. This is important for inverter life.

11. Ask about Waranty; panel warranties should be 25 Years with 5-10 years at a minimum of 90% of the stated output and the balance of the term at 80%, the inverter guarentee should be 5-7 years (hard to get longer).

12. Ask about inverter life; if you are borrowing money to fund your Solar Panels you need to factor in 2 (yes 2) replacements. Inverters are getting better by the month but even now 12 years is a fantastic life span even for the best makes. Incidentally this is why the design relationship between panel and inverter is crucial run them too 'hot' and it shortens their life run them too 'cold' and you lose output.

13. Ask about panel size v output, for instance we use different manufacturers that in the 999mm x 1600mm panel format produce panels with an outputs of 230, 235 and 330, the largest output is not neccessarily the best value - that depends on the system design!

FINALLY COST:

We fit large scale (400+ property orders) at an average of less than £3.00 watt (an average 3 bed should handle a 10 panel say 2.3KW system quite comfortably which equates to £6,900). Open markt this is likely to set you back around £8,500.

Our 2.3 KW systems (monitored) are currently overperforming their design performance by around 20%. So the above systems in Birmingham (returns vary regionally) are returning £900 PA or (without inflation increases) 22.5K over the 25 years. FIT payment is tax free so blows socks off any ISA (but remember allow a cost of say £1000 in year 10 and again in year 20 for replacing the Inverter!)

One of the biggest points here, at least for me, is the price £3.00/watt or £3,000/kiloWatt. Use this as a bench mark and if the company your discussing with want more, then ask them to justify it or find another supplier.

F.

keith_r59

Freepost wrote: »

One of the biggest points here, at least for me, is the price £3.00/watt or £3,000/kiloWatt. Use this as a bench mark and if the company your discussing with want more, then ask them to justify it or find another supplier.

F.

I would be wary of using this as a benchmark for a single installation as by the original posters own admission this figure relates to large scale orders of 400+ properties.

Better to get five quotes from a mixture of companies (local and national) and then make your selection based on price, technical knowledge, references etc.

Dave_Fowler

Cardew wrote: »

As it was such a useful post for potential customers, I wonder if some other firm's representatives haven't got it zapped!!

It's not the only useful post that's been zapped. A website which I won't name - for fear of being zapped - has just posted:

When I was considering the installation of solar panels last year I picked up a lot of information from the posters on the Money Saving Expert forums and realised how useful user comment could be. That is one reason I maintain this website and many people have told me they have found it useful. However if I answer a question posed on the Money Saving Expert forum and refer to this website for more information my post is rapidly deleted. It would appear that MSE doesn’t really want to help its members at all. It wouldn’t be the only forum where absolute power has corrupted absolutely so I no longer visit it. It is no loss to me but unfortunately MSE's priority being to protect itself will in a small way adversely affect the people it purports to want to help.

Perhaps the moderators may think again before they delete posts if they realize the MSE forum is getting a bad name amongst its own well intentioned and honorable members.

Dave F

Foxy_Scott

Dave_Fowler wrote: »

Perhaps the moderators may think again before they delete posts if they realize the MSE forum is getting a bad name amongst its own well intentioned and honorable members.

Dave F

Couldn't they just redact rather than delete?

Foxy_Scott

Freepost wrote: »

One of the biggest points here, at least for me, is the price £3.00/watt or £3,000/kiloWatt. Use this as a bench mark and if the company your discussing with want more, then ask them to justify it or find another supplier.

F.

Tescos 4KW system falls just under this then with the current 20% discount, is there any need to look further given the chances of smaller companies disappearing after installation and therefore the support.

Tescos are using NSA in my area to install. The surveyor that came seemed knowledgeable he calculated the roof area by measuring the outer walls and height in the loft.

He also noted to Tesco to install solar edge invertors to maintain panel performance should the gable of my neighbours house partially shadow my roof.

Dave_Fowler

Foxy_Scott wrote: »

Couldn't they just redact rather than delete?

I can't see why they don't just leave the post untouched. The website referred to appears to be privately owned, informative and non-commercial.

Dave F