redundant then tupe with no redundancy ?

bronzedg

I work for a company that is used in a bigger company & as they have terminated there contract with the company i work for the company has to make me redundant as they no longer have any work for me. I received a letter advising me that i was being made redundant & details of the payout i was going to receive. The day before i am abotu to leave i have now received a letter saying they go back on that & are not offering me any redundancy & are going to tupe me over which i do not quite understand as i am working for a totally different company but within the same larger company & the new company have not agreed to anything with this company i am working for now are they really allowed to do this ?

McKneff

I think you need to ring ACAS, as far as I was aware once you were offered redundancy they could not rescind this without your agreement, I may be wrong but ring ACAS and find out for sure

SarEl

McKneff wrote: »

I think you need to ring ACAS, as far as I was aware once you were offered redundancy they could not rescind this without your agreement, I may be wrong but ring ACAS and find out for sure

Sorry - yes you are wrong. Redundancy can be rescinded right up to the last second of employment. There is no right to be made redundant ever - the converse is true. If the employer can "save the job" by fining a suitable alternative employment (or in this case a TUPE) then they must do so.

unholyangel

TUPE usually means that all your existing contract conditions are carried over to the new company (from what i remember anyway).

So it may not really be as bad as you think

bronzedg

ah so your saying things like my service etc would be carried over ? If this is the case then it is certainly not a tupe as the company i am going to work for gave me a job as i applied to them the company i work for did not find the job for me

unholyangel

Were you's advised by them to apply for the job? Having to apply for the job in itself doesnt mean you were made redundant. It can actually be quite common to ask employee's to reapply for remaining roles/new roles as part of a redundancy procedure.

If it is a TUPE then your service should carry over. Read here for more info: http://www.acas.org.uk/index.aspx?articleid=1655

If you are being TUPE'd over then effectively, you're not redundant as you still have your job.

To add: if you're signing on with the new employer under a new contract with no service carried over then IMO you were redundant from your previous job.

SarEl

Reading the first post - the company the OP is going to work for terminated the work with the smaller company and took it in house. This would make it a TUPE - they must take on the staff doing the job before. That is the law. So the OP applying for a job or whatever is a red herring - the job should have been TUPE'd and they have obviously now realised this. The OP transfers to the new company with service and conditions intact.

bronzedg

No the work hasnt been taken in house the company used to employ people in house then went to agencies & then went to employing contract companies. I worked for the company & got made redundant & then worked for the agency & got laid off i then applied to the contract company who employed me & now they have had there contract terminated & have no other work for me so sent me a letter saying as there was no facility for me to work for that company i was being made redundant. I then found out the company who were going to take the contract over & i had to go for a formal interview & will not get any service etc as the new company have advised they are not agreeing to this tupe & the bosses at the main place i worked are disgraced as they know what is going on is wrong as we have in fact lost our jobs, if i had been taken on by another company elsewhere how would they get away with this ?

LittleVoice

It might help if you wrote down the sequence of events with some idea of dates, naming the companies A, B, C and their relationship one with another. The reference to "contract companies", "the company", "agencies" and so on makes it difficult to follow (or I may be profoundly dense at this time of night).

unholyangel

LittleVoice wrote: »

It might help if you wrote down the sequence of events with some idea of dates, naming the companies A, B, C and their relationship one with another. The reference to "contract companies", "the company", "agencies" and so on makes it difficult to follow (or I may be profoundly dense at this time of night).

I think they're saying the company they were employed by (A) were contracted by company (B). Company B have terminated the contract with Company A and as a result, Company A notified OP that they were being made redundant as they had no alternative work for them.

OP has discovered Company C are taking over this contract with Company B and applied with them. Company A have found this out and are now saying it isnt a redundancy situation.

Company C are employing her under a new contract and not under her previous contract conditions with Company A (so not TUPE and Company A did not offer or assist in finding alternative work - at least from what i understand of the posts).

Question is, if its not a redundancy situation then would Company A's reason fall within the statutory fair reasons for dismissal or be considered unfair/wrongful?

SarEl

unholyangel wrote: »

I think they're saying the company they were employed by (A) were contracted by company (B). Company B have terminated the contract with Company A and as a result, Company A notified OP that they were being made redundant as they had no alternative work for them.

OP has discovered Company C are taking over this contract with Company B and applied with them. Company A have found this out and are now saying it isnt a redundancy situation.

Company C are employing her under a new contract and not under her previous contract conditions with Company A (so not TUPE and Company A did not offer or assist in finding alternative work - at least from what i understand of the posts).

Question is, if its not a redundancy situation then would Company A's reason fall within the statutory fair reasons for dismissal or be considered unfair/wrongful?

Assuming this to be correct - and I agree that the post is unclear - it is still a TUPE and not a redundancy. If company A loose the contract to company C then the employees must be TUPE'd to company C. It's case law. The case will come to mind when I stop thinking about it, probably about 3 am!