Opt out's - Scottish power

andymg

Last year (2010) I signed up to scottish power's online deal and the contract was till May 2011.

In around Feb 2011 Scottish power sent out email's to all their customers informing them that they will be automatically moved on to another contract and the customer need to respond if they dont want to be tied up into the contract.

Now I'm not sure if I received this email or not but in principle I find it hard to believe that they would automatically opt-in customers for new contract. I did not sign up for rolling contacts or automatic opt-in and was expecting to be moved on to the standard rates without contract.

Surely the right practice would be to ask customer to say Yes to a new contact? Rather than just signing them up and asking them to say No? This seems to be a sneeky way to keep customers.

Similar thing happened with Vodaphone as well, I specifically asked to be sent paper bills. They send a txt message saying that I will be signed up to paperless bills and I need to opt out if I want to continue with paper billing.

There might be some people who would say that I was informed and should have taken action but its more of a question of principle and ethics (well, atleast to me). These companies should not be making decisions on behalf of their customers and asking them to opt-out. I get fair bit of emails and text messages and it takes effort to opt out.

BTW, I fought with these companies and managed to get the charges reversed! But they were not willing to accept this as a issue!!

What are your thoughts? Am I in the wrong in my thinking?

balmk

If you check the terms of your original agreement, you will probably see it in there that you will be moved to a new tariff following the end of your promotional/fixed rate one.

andymg

balmk wrote: »

If you check the terms of your original agreement, you will probably see it in there that you will be moved to a new tariff following the end of your promotional/fixed rate one.

Not really, I did speak to scottish gas and they did confirm that I did not sign up to a rolling contract. The new tariff should be the standard tariff with no tie-in's.

marks7389

Scottish Power have been in trouble over this sort of thing before:

http://www.moneysavingexpert.com/news/utilities/2009/09/scottish-power-faces-probe-over-unfair-lock-ins

I'm in a similar position. Having received the notification back in March, and despite being out of the country at the time, I initiated a switch a little over a week later. The requirement was to opt out before the end of April and despite the switching taking longer to complete (electricity on the 5th May, gas will be sometime in June) they obviously had plenty of warning that I was indeed opting out and even phoned me at the end of April to try to persuade me to remain with them.

Of course on receiving my final electicity bill this morning the cancellation charge is there and I assume the same will be true of my final gas bill.

I have phoned them this morning to ask them to remove the charge and have told them that I am cancelling the direct debit and will settle the bill less the cancellation charge. I'm waiting to hear back from them, but if they refuse to remove it I will take it up with Ofgem / the Energy Ombudsman on principle.

Even if the original terms and conditions say they can do this (and ignoring the fact that I had opted out in any case) I would argue that any such terms are unenforcable under the Unfair Contract Terms Act.

Ofcom appears to be taking steps to specifically ban similar telecomms contracts:

http://www.which.co.uk/news/2011/03/ofcom-proposes-ban-on-opt-out-rollover-contracts-246528/

margf

Hi

I to find myself in the same position, I have settled my bills less the cancellation charges and I am now receiving letters from debt collectors for the cancellation charges.

Marg

marks7389

margf wrote: »

Hi

I to find myself in the same position, I have settled my bills less the cancellation charges and I am now receiving letters from debt collectors for the cancellation charges.

Marg

Which is why I have asked them to remove them, will raise the issue with the Energy Ombudsman if necessary to adjudicate and will tell both Scottish Power and any debt collection agency that is what is happening.

marks7389

To confirm what Andymg has said, there was nothing in the original terms and conditions about Scottish Power having any right to extend the tie-in period, only about cancellation charges for the period up to the 31st March 2011. Indeed it is doubtful I would ever have signed up to anything that did provide for them to do that.

Their attempts to impose such conditions by default surely cannot be legally enforcable.

andymg

I was really furious when the lady said that we sent you the notification - you should have taken action. Well they can’t automatically put me on a tariff and ask me to opt out. They ought to sign me up and opt me in explicitly!

Anyway that was that for Electricity switch, I think I'll have another fight over Gas switch. I'm extremely surprised and annoyed with the way these big companies’ takes people for a ride!

marks7389

andymg wrote: »

I was really furious when the lady said that we sent you the notification - you should have taken action. Well they can’t automatically put me on a tariff and ask me to opt out. They ought to sign me up and opt me in explicitly!

Anyway that was that for Electricity switch, I think I'll have another fight over Gas switch. I'm extremely surprised and annoyed with the way these big companies’ takes people for a ride!

And having taken action they are still trying to slap me with the charges....:eek:

I have to say I am really disappointed with Scottish Power. I thought they were among the more highly regarded suppliers for customer service, but they clearly don't care about stitching up anyone who has decided or might decide to go to another supplier and that will surely cost them repeat business in the long term.

The ironic thing is that if I had seen what they were planning to do I might well have stuck with them, particularly given that some of their more recent offerings have been pretty competative. However the very thought that they were trying to tie me into something without my explicit agreement got me on the switching sites PDQ.

Interestingly Ofgem seem to be shying away from banning this sort of thing outright, but there's nothing in their consultantion document that actually considers whether this kind of thing is ethical or legally enforcable (in this case I believe it to be neither given that the original terms and conditions do not explicitly allow them to do this).

I suspect their approach is to give in under sufficient pressure in individual cases so that it is never tested, on the basis that most people don't realise they never agreed to the charge or can't be bothered to fight it.

http://www.ofgem.gov.uk/Markets/RetMkts/Compet/Documents1/Fixed%20Term%20Offers_Consultation%20Final.pdf

marks7389

The original terms and conditions are here for Online Energy Saver 9. The only thing I can find which conceivably covers anything like this is clause 5.8 / 9.8 (variation of terms) and that requires 65 working days notice of the change (which wasn't the case here - it was more like half that).

http://www.scottishpower.co.uk/pdf/OnlineEnergySaver9.pdf

oldandhappy

Be aware that when you cancel your direct debit there can be problems. Scottish Power in my case managed to set up 1st intial payment again so carried on taking my money after I clearly cancelled with my bank and SP. I had also paid by debit card outstanding amounts although not the final bills because they where hugely over estimated and into a dispute with them.They would not except my correct readings.My new supplier had also given them the same readings but did not use them!
Thanks only to the Scottish Power Rep on here for sorting out the whole stressful episode.