British Work Ethic Condemned

chewmylegoff

ninky wrote: »

i wonder if they are helping christopher lunn help the hmrc with their enquiries.....often union subs seem like a small price to pay in a crisis.

seems unlikely that they are doing anything for christopher lunn, as a quick google indicates that he is not a member of the ICAEW (or any other professional body).

being able to call yourself an accountant is not a "worthless service" at all, it's pretty useful (and it's free for me anyway as my employer covers the cost).

i'm sure there are much more wide reaching benefits for some members, but it's not that relevant to me as i don't work in practice, so i haven't bothered to ever find out anything about it.

ninky_2

chewmylegoff wrote: »

seems unlikely that they are doing anything for christopher lunn, as a quick google indicates that he is not a member of the ICAEW (or any other professional body).

being able to call yourself an accountant is not a "worthless service" at all, it's pretty useful (and it's free for me anyway as my employer covers the cost).

i'm sure there are much more wide reaching benefits for some members, but it's not that relevant to me as i don't work in practice, so i haven't bothered to ever find out anything about it.

yes he resigned after being bankrupted by customs and excise in the mid 1990s. however his firm still continued to operate as accountants so clearly he was still able to use the term 'accountant' which means i'm not sure what you are paying for. he might wish he was still a member given the current shenanigans going on. clearly your employer thinks it is worth it for you and i would suggest that one of the benefits is the legal help and professional indemnification it gives you in case of a problem arising.

i'm a member of a union. they provide me with contract advice from time to time as well as cheap pli and i know there is legal support and backing if i needed it. i'm self employed and always have been so maybe i'm used to finding out these things for myself as i am the one having to pay out for it.

Conrad

We've been discussing 2 local ethnically Asian shop keepers here, both of whom we know very well. Neither has ever had a holiday. In one thier daughter spent all her holidays being in the shop. They work incredibly long hours and are even open Xmas day. Both say to me they just love work, period. All the white shop keepers do go on holliday and dont work as long hours.
They are humble and modest yet as they are cleints of mine I know both are very comfortable, with a string of let properties. Both urge thier children to go into medicine.

The zeal to amass money (at the expense of family fun) is apparnatly ok'd by the Koran?

I see this as a microchosym of the East / West global business debate in fact.

However, I do see this relentless work ethic to have a downside as for example India has huge wealth disparity and despite all the religious virtue, this relentless lust for money at all costs (never taking kids on holiday) does not seem to bring about a healthy rounded society, but I could well be talking nonsense as I have never been to India myself.

IronWolf

The only way I will work 15 hour days is if I get a direct benefit from it. If I owned my own business, then I would. But working for another company, that doesnt even pay overtime...sorry but Im doing my contracted hours. If you want me to consistently work longer hours, then pay more or change the contract because Im not free labour.

Kennyboy66

Conrad wrote: »

We've been discussing 2 local ethnically Asian shop keepers here, both of whom we know very well. Neither has ever had a holiday. In one thier daughter spent all her holidays being in the shop. They work incredibly long hours and are even open Xmas day. Both say to me they just love work, period. All the white shop keepers do go on holliday and dont work as long hours.
They are humble and modest yet as they are cleints of mine I know both are very comfortable, with a string of let properties. Both urge thier children to go into medicine.

The zeal to amass money (at the expense of family fun) is apparnatly ok'd by the Koran?

I see this as a microchosym of the East / West global business debate in fact.

However, I do see this relentless work ethic to have a downside as for example India has huge wealth disparity and despite all the religious virtue, this relentless lust for money at all costs (never taking kids on holiday) does not seem to bring about a healthy rounded society, but I could well be talking nonsense as I have never been to India myself.

Why assume they are muslim ?

Would they be taking a mortgage out if they were strict adherents ?

The most sucessful group of 20th century immigrants to the UK were the Ugandan asians expelled by Amin.

They were mostly Hindu.

Anyone in education will tell you that one of the problems is Muslim families taking extended holidays to Pakistan (as an example) and their kids missing chunks of school time.

ninky_2

Conrad wrote: »

We've been discussing 2 local ethnically Asian shop keepers here, both of whom we know very well. Neither has ever had a holiday. In one thier daughter spent all her holidays being in the shop. They work incredibly long hours and are even open Xmas day. Both say to me they just love work, period. All the white shop keepers do go on holliday and dont work as long hours.
They are humble and modest yet as they are cleints of mine I know both are very comfortable, with a string of let properties. Both urge thier children to go into medicine.

The zeal to amass money (at the expense of family fun) is apparnatly ok'd by the Koran?

I see this as a microchosym of the East / West global business debate in fact.

However, I do see this relentless work ethic to have a downside as for example India has huge wealth disparity and despite all the religious virtue, this relentless lust for money at all costs (never taking kids on holiday) does not seem to bring about a healthy rounded society, but I could well be talking nonsense as I have never been to India myself.

i think you are. india (and indians) is a diverse as the human race itself. most indians aren't muslim so the contents of the koran to the price of bread is about as relevant as the colour of my eyes to this post.

ninky_2

IronWolf wrote: »

The only way I will work 15 hour days is if I get a direct benefit from it. If I owned my own business, then I would. But working for another company, that doesnt even pay overtime...sorry but Im doing my contracted hours. If you want me to consistently work longer hours, then pay more or change the contract because Im not free labour.

without a union to back you however what's to stop our employer finding someone who will work unpaid overtime?

Conrad

ninky wrote: »

i think you are. india (and indians) is a diverse as the human race itself. most indians aren't muslim so the contents of the koran to the price of bread is about as relevant as the colour of my eyes to this post.

One shop keeper here is Muslim, the other hindu, both devoutely religious and spend ALL thier time amassing personal fortunes. I'm dying to ask what is the point of life when every waking hour is spent in work but worry it would offend. This ties in with the comments by Mr Tata.

There is a 3rd convienience store at the other end of town run by a guy of Pakistani origin and again he never has holls and only works, but I have not spoken to him lately, hence why I did not mention him prior. He also has several properties.

I hate it when we cannot dicuss such facts of life for fear of somehow being dubbed a racist. We would have no problem discussing the fact Brits are on average fatter than Frechies for example, so why the need for egg shells when discussing people with a different skin colour.

All 3 of these guys love to tell you how lazy the locals are ("the British are so lazy, you just cannot get the staff"), by which they definitely mean the whites, as they are the only people who have worked for them.

In summary, yes, white Brits are quite lazy in comparison, but on the other hand I think perhaps British culture has got to a more developed stage where people think beyond everyday things like work, and seek a more balanced life and that in time Mr Tata will find the same happens with lets say Indian culture.

Conrad

Kennyboy66 wrote: »

Anyone in education will tell you that one of the problems is Muslim families taking extended holidays to Pakistan (as an example) and their kids missing chunks of school time.

Perhaps the 3 families here who run the shops are a dying breed? I still think Tata is onto something though, Brits do not work as hard (I'm assuming he probably means white Brits).

ninky_2

Conrad wrote: »

One shop keeper here is Muslim, the other hindu, both devoutely religious and spend ALL thier time amassing personal fortunes. I'm dying to ask what is the point of life when every waking hour is spent in work but worry it would offend. This ties in with the comments by Mr Tata.

There is a 3rd convienience store at the other end of town run by a guy of Pakistani origin and again he never has holls and only works, but I have not spoken to him lately, hence why I did not mention him prior. He also has several properties.

I hate it when we cannot dicuss such facts of life for fear of somehow being dubbed a racist. We would have no problem discussing the fact Brits are on average fatter than Frechies for example, so why the need for egg shells when discussing people with a different skin colour.

All 3 of these guys love to tell you how lazy the locals are ("the British are so lazy, you just cannot get the staff"), by which they definitely mean the whites, as they are the only people who have worked for them.

In summary, yes, white Brits are quite lazy in comparison, but on the other hand I think perhaps our culture has got to a more developed stage where people think beyond everyday things like work, and seek a more balanced life and that in time Mr Tata will find the same happens with lets say Indian culture.

did you see the second series of 'the family'? the one featuring the asian family? that will show you how accurate your idea of asians as across the board workaholics is. i think the problem with your post is you are taking a few anecdotals mixed in with a heavy dose of sterotype and are using that to draw conclusions about one race. or is it actually a religion or nationality because your post doesn't make it at all clear?