3 - charging for text delivery receipts

Makeandsave

I am wondering if the MSE team and make a temeplate letter for use to email in with everything in it.

Bricks

It would surely have made more sense for 3 to quietly introduce this into all new contracts, rather than p***ing off loads of their existing customers by introducing extra charges at short notice and making up stupid excuses for why they have "had" to do it.

johnnyj_2

Maybe we should notify BBC watchdog over this. the fact they are fobbing us off until the 6th June just shows they think this will go away. Time to get this on TV
I have rang Customer services several times, getting no where. I pointed out everything and they just talk rubbish. I even had one call hang up on me. Im getting tired.

Regards

johnnyj_2

Just rang 3 to inform them that I’m sending this complaint with a link to this forum to BBC watchdog. the lady wants to wait for a manager before I hit the submit button.


He has now asked me to hold the line while he checks something.....

He checked with our previous correspondence and sadly he will just tell me what he is telling everyone else. You take what ever action you feel necessary. I told him I’m just about to hit the submit button now. He said go ahead.

The lady before him did tell me they have had loads of calls over this.

Snakeeyes21

johnnyj wrote: »

Just rang 3 to inform them that I’m sending this complaint with a link to this forum to BBC watchdog. the lady wants to wait for a manager before I hit the submit button.


He has now asked me to hold the line while he checks something.....

He checked with our previous correspondence and sadly he will just tell me what he is telling everyone else. You take what ever action you feel necessary. I told him I’m just about to hit the submit button now. He said go ahead.

The lady before him did tell me they have had loads of calls over this.

And what is it you think watchdog can do? They take months to look in to stories.
By that time you would gave accepted the new terms.
Theres no point getting in to petty bickering with them.
Just email the exec office pointing out what has been said in this thread.
Giving them 7 days to release you from your contract.
If they fail to do so ring up and get your pac, cancel your contract.
And put in a claim with the court and get the fees overturned and recover any expences you have / will incur moving to a new network / plan.

filobeto_2

New response from them following my 2nd letter:

I’m sorry that you had to write to us about canceling your contract. I understand you feel that we’ve made changes to your contract services without your consent.

You took this 24 months contract on X. You agreed for a £20 Text price plan which includes:

• 2000 3 to 3 calls
• 200 UK voice minutes
• 4000 texts
• 2gb internet access

We promised you this allowance when you signed up this contract online and these are your core contract services. As we didn’t promise you free delivery reports as a part of your allowance, this is not detrimental change to your contract.

If you’re still unhappy with this and want to cancel your contract you’ll need to pay an early termination fee which is around £59. We’ll also need a 30 days’ notice to close your account.

I hope this information helps. If you have any questions please call us on 0800 358 4916 between10am and 5pm (Monday – Friday) - free from a Three mobile, network call charges may be applicable from any other phone.


Regards

Doesn't look like they are for shifting

valentin_alcalde

After a few e-mail and talking on the phone with the executive office, they says there is nothing they can do and they will send me a deadlock letter as I requested.
Could I really do something with it?
I would appreciate any help.
Thanks in advance

valentin_alcalde

Here are the e-mails that I sent and response from the executive office:

Phone number: xxxxxxx
Name:
Date of birth:

Date 22/05/2011

Hi.

I have on the 18/05/2011 on the phone xxxxx and on the 19/05/2011 on the phone xxxxx been informed that from the 6th June 2011 you will start to charge £0.01 for
recieving sms delivery reports, I wasnt informed by yourself but through various forums I frequent.

As you will no doubt be aware my contract states that a minimum of 30 days notice is
required to make changes to my contract that have a detrimental affect on me.

This is a breach of contract and the new charges are now unenforceable

Please see point 4.1(b) of your terms and coditions attached.

4.1 (b) we will let you know at least one calendar month in advance if we decide to
(i) discontinue your package or
(ii) make any variations to your agreement which are likely to be of detriment to you
(iii) increase the fixed periodic charge of your package by any amount that is more than the
percetage increase in the retail price index figure iay 12 month period.

following on from the above it states: (the important bits are bolded)

you can end the agreement for such variations as explained in section 10 .
subject to the above you will not be able to end your agreement if such
variations or increase:
(i) is due to change tothe law, government regulation or licence which affect us, or
(ii) which soley relates to additional services: or
(iii) relates soley to add-on(s)

I was told by a customer services rep that the new charge is for a service that is currently
an additional service, so im not able to cancel without penalty, this is not the case.

as per your own glossary of terms in your terms and conditions it states;

Additional services: additional or supplemental services for which a charge is made in
addition to the fixed periodic charges for your package or add-on(s)

a charge is currently not applied to sms delivery reports and as per your terms and
conditions a charge needs to be made for it to be classed as a additional service.

also sms delivery reports do not currently show on your bills as an additional service all
be it billed at £0.00

this new charge is a charge for something that is currently included in the monthly payment I
make, this change of contract will have a detrimental effect on my agreement, at my current
levels it will add to my contract per month to my bill as I require reports for messages sent.

As per my terms and conditions I would like to give my 30 days notice to cancel my contracts
without penalty.

Please reply to this email to confrm my request to cancel without penalty will be processd
within the 30 days notice I have given

Thanks


then they reply:

Hello Mr Alcalde


You contacted us recently about the charge we're introducing for our text delivery report service.

This charge isn't a detrimental change to the terms and conditions of your account with us, because it's a non-core service.

We won’t be closing your account without charge on this basis. You can still cancel by providing 30 days notice and paying the early termination fee of £168.40.

If you’d like me to go ahead and close the account, please let me know by replying to this email or calling me at the Executive Office on 08433 733 330 (calls are charged at 5p/min from a BT landline, other networks may vary). We’re open 9am until 6.30pm, Monday to Friday.

I hope I’ve clearly explained our position in this matter.


Thank you



Rochelle Findlay
Three Executive Office

I answered:


As I explained in my previous e-mail, the delivery report should have been on my bills even if it was at 0.00 charged. As it was not, now this is something that I am not willing to pay.
Also I should have been informed 30 days in advance.
I would then request a deadlock letter.
Thanks

They answered:

Hello Mr Alcalde


There is no requirement for any customer to pay for SMS delivery reports. You can turn off this feature on your phone to avoid being charged using the following steps:

From the Home screen, tap Messages.
Select Menu and Tap Settings.
Scroll to SMS settings and remove the tick within Delivery Reports by tapping the box.

Further details on this can be found at the following welink: three

As explained previously, this charge isn't a detrimental change to the terms and conditions of your account with us, because it's a non-core service. On this basis, we don't need to give you 30 days notice, as stipulated in section 4.1 b (ii) of our terms and conditions.

We’re not in a position of deadlock as the information we are providing is correct and you aren’t obliged to pay these charges.

If you’d like to discuss this further, I would welcome a call from you. The number for the Executive Office is 08433 733 330 (calls are charged at 5p/min from a BT landline, other networks may vary). We’re open 9am until 6.30pm, Monday to Friday.

I hope I’ve further explained our position in this matter.


Thank you.



Rochelle Findlay
Three Executive Office


I answered:


Hello, and thank you for your response.


Your terms and conditions state:

"Glossary - Specific words and phrases that need further explanation."


"Additional Services: additional or supplemental services for which a charge
is made in addition to the fixed periodic charges for your Package or
Add-on(s) (if applicable)."

Resultantly it comes down to:
1. "Additional Services" are clearly defined as a service above and beyond
that sold to you as your package or talk-plan, and are purchased in addition
to the above.

2. Whilst not specifically defined anywhere by Three, "Core Services"(your
terms) must therefore be assumed to be anything that came as a part of your
package at the time of agreeing the contract.

SMS delivery reports don't show up on my past bills at a zero-charged rate -
and therefore can't be an additional service under your criteria. I have
never been billed for them, they have never been itemised. At no point in my
contract signing, or in any billing since then, has it been shown that I
have taken up with you "Additional Services". It cannot be an "Additional
Service" based upon your T and C definition above.

As such, I still feel that this is a variation to my original contract, and
of detriment to me, and repeat my original request to cancel my contract
and have my PAC supplied or get a dead lock letter issued as I am in contact with ombudsman and will need the letter.

Many thanks in advance


And this was 4 days ago, so today I called and is when they said they will send me the deadlock letter...

simax

Like I said at the start, you won't get anywhere.

JudasPriest

I guess people in this thread now need to decide whether they wish to actively pursue this. I will be, but judging from the posted communication, it'll be a drawn out thing and involve hassle from Three for those walking from their contract due to this.

Anybody using the services from Three on or after 6th June accept the changes by doing so. It looks like those wishing to pursue the matter have to remove the SIM and use alternative services and pursue this legally.

We promised you this allowance when you signed up this contract online and these are your core contract services. As we didn’t promise you free delivery reports as a part of your allowance, this is not detrimental change to your contract.

They're still trying to change the terms after contract inception. If it's not an "Additional Service", then it's grounds for leaving the contract. There is no definition of what is, or is not, core. A Google "site:three.co.uk" search for "core service" yields zero results. "core services" gives one - but it's a user comment on a blog post. Nothing in the terms and conditions, nothing in their price guide, nothing on my invoice when making the purchase.

Delivery report charges were checked by me in-store prior to taking out a contract - I have the name of the member of staff, and the date. The day I received my SIM, I made a telephone call to Customer Services to confirm there were no charges - this was confirmed, and I have the date and time of that call.

It may feel fruitless, but you all have good grounds for fighting this change in my opinion. I have to - if I continue to use their services after the change in the manner I did when taking out the contract, I'll face an additional £200 of charges over my term. Alternative is to lose included and needed functionality that was a major part of deciding to use Three.

I'm on the "One Plan" - 2000 x-net minutes, 5000 texts, 5000 minutes to Three mobiles, unlimited internet, and included tethering. To get the same functionality and services, it'll mean taking out services from several other providers. The cheapest way I can do this:-

http://giffgaff.com/goodybags/25pound-unlimited-data

Giffgaff do unlimited data, free delivery reports, and unlimited texts. An extra 500 minutes(to match the deal from Three) at 8ppm will bump up the cost per month by £40. Believe it or not, that's still the most cost-effective alternative as all other networks have a hidden limit to their "unlimited" data.

http://shop.virginmedia.com/broadband/up-to-10mb.html

But tethering isn't included, so I'll need a second set of services at home for unlimited broadband. As I don't have a landline, the cheapest option for this is Virgin Media, at £21 per month for their lowest offering. A total of £96 per month - or £66 per month more than it would cost through Three.

Over 20 months, that'll be £1330 out of my pocket for the same functionality using the cheapest alternative services I can find, and the basis of going to small claims. Wouldn't mind advice from people if they know of better value deals?