Best web design courses? Is web design a good job? =]

[Deleted User]

4 days.. to modify a template? Blimey

It took me 7 days to write a customised Content management system (a mini social network). That was a bespoke design, database, admin system and testing.

Right, off to learn about E4X

Discodave

ringo_24601 wrote: »

4 days.. to modify a template? Blimey

It took me 7 days to write a customised Content management system (a mini social network). That was a bespoke design, database, admin system and testing.

Right, off to learn about E4X

4 days when you work full time is only roughly 4 hours day, after 7 when I get back in.

TBF, the customer knows what they get before I start as they choose the template

They also get updates per month, (as/when for the 1st year), then once monthly thereafter, or They can have their own FTP upload login (or both), alongside hosting for 2 years. Also, No, i don't just leave it alone once its built. I work on the megatags, keywords etc on a weekly basis, changing content now and again to help with google search. As you will see its using HMTL which works better then flash imo. You can't tell me a company that charges £200 a month for SEO will get you higher on google than your normal website designer. thats not how it works. that what they SAY, for you to part with you cash, but paying for SEO is unnecessary imo. Banklinks, proper written (proofread) content, changing on a regular basis, along with proper megatags/descriptions will work just as good. Neither you, or a SEO company will get you where you wanna be within a 1 week, month or even 6 months, so you mite as well keep your £2400 a year and spend it elsewhere.

You both try and make me out as though i'm ripping folk off. Also, it takes time to modify as its not just simple changes. The customer has changed 1 page, 4 times, both layout and content. Just because i use Dreamweaver, which is WYSIWYG type of sofwares, does not mean I don't know HTML code.

TBH, £250 after expenses for this current job (domain name, hosting etc) leaves me with about £220, works out around £7.60 per hour of working on the time.

Would like to see some sites you have done and prices you charged.

relic

Discodave wrote: »

4 days when you work full time is only roughly 4 hours day, after 7 when I get back in.

TBF, the customer knows what they get before I start as they choose the template

They also get updates per month, (as/when for the 1st year), then once monthly thereafter, or They can have their own FTP upload login (or both), alongside hosting for 2 years. Also, No, i don't just leave it alone once its build, and work on the megatags, keywords etc on a weekly basis, changing content now and again to help with google search. As you will see its using HMTL which works better then flash imo

You both try and make me out as though i'm ripping folk off. Also, it takes time to modify as its not just simple changes. The customer has changed 1 page, 4 times, both layout and content. Just because i use Dreamweaver, which is WYSIWYG type of sofwares, does not mean I don't know HTML code.

TBH, £250 after expenses for this current job (domain name, hosting etc) leaves me with about £220, works out around £7.60 per hour of working on the time.

Would like to see some sites you have done and prices you charged.

This current job is for a friend, isn't it? So that doesn't explain your usual rates of pay.

And 29 hours to setup a template, add content, host and perhaps modify it a bit every month seems a bit ridiculous to me.

Whatever, I was just trying to point out to the OP that you are not what I would call a web designer. You modify and upload pre bought templates.

Reggie_Rebel

Discodave wrote: »

this was done in DW ... www.gentlehands.co.uk
and this was done using a pre-designed template

You may want to look at the links on that one, the Guild of Holistic Therapists image is a clickable link to a facebook page, a bit mis leading

Discodave

relic wrote: »

This current job is for a friend, isn't it? So that doesn't explain your usual rates of pay.

And 29 hours to setup a template, add content, host and perhaps modify it a bit every month seems a bit ridiculous to me.

I really do hope the customers know what they are getting!

I really don't like you! lol - It's like you're saying i'm rubbish at my job (hobby)

I never once claimed to be a professional web developer, designer or anything of the sort (sorry if that how I made you think)

I am self taught in Dreamweaver/Photoshop and just enjoy designing websites as hobby for family or friends. I don't have a portfolio or will I have one, as the sites I have done are in need of a revamp. Besides, I am not looking to go professional.

www.gentlehands.co.uk was my first one (this is 1 that needs a looking at! - I'm sure you'll agree and pull it to bits!)

Discodave

Reggie_Rebel wrote: »

You may want to look at the links on that one, the Guild of Holistic Therapists image is a clickable link to a facebook page, a bit mis leading

fixed..

and sorry, no template was used for this, was done in DW from scratch

mumcoll

My son spent 3 years at uni and got a 2:1 in graphic design. He often says most of what he learned, including webdesign, he learned after he had graduated - as in uni there was very little teaching - they were just given projects to do. He has built up his portfolio by freelancing and also being employed.

Discodave

mumcoll wrote: »

My son spent 3 years at uni and got a 2:1 in graphic design. He often says most of what he learned, including webdesign, he learned after he had graduated - as in uni there was very little teaching - they were just given projects to do. He has built up his portfolio by freelancing and also being employed.

tbh, its like driving... you're always learning after you pass

like today, I learnt something new (not on website design or driving), but on Excel, and I've been using that for 7 years

alisonmeyers

But dave, I've already SAID that there is a perfectly valid market for what you're doing. I really do. My local butcher has a site that you can pre-rorder your Xmas turkeys on, and it sends a little confirmation email once it's done, I think that's fab. They don't NEED more than your services are offered. Tweaking templates here and there, adding enough content that they are being updated, that's great.

I'm simply saying that the little hobby end of the market is swamped. People who are calling themselves professional website developers (I know you don't claim this).

Also, because I've worked at my brother's web design/SEO agency for a couple of years, I did want to address this:

Banklinks, proper written (proofread) content, changing on a regular basis, along with proper megatags/descriptions will work just as good."

Agree in most small business cases. In fact you might learn enough just by going to tech forums and googling around to get you started if you're a small local business, that's good.

"but paying for SEO is unnecessary imo. Neither you, or a SEO company will get you where you wanna be within a 1 week, month or even 6 months, so you mite as well keep your £2400 a year and spend it elsewhere.

I will have to politely disagree. In the first year I did the invoicing (admin) stuff for his company, and I saw how non-local businesses work on the web with companies other than my plumbing examples/etc (who don't need huge web expenses, I'll agree, not much to be gained). But I'm not sure you have any idea what you're talking about. You've only been exposed to a niche, small end market in the web development industry.

I don't want to say too much because I've already been identified on here once (:o) but in the 1st year I worked there a large cereal brand (international) hired my brother's agency to develop and promote a new product, aimed at kids. I had absolutely NO idea how cutthroat that area of the market is (targetting kids and parents online e.g. meal ideas, snack ideas). They literally had a multi-million pound advertising budget to launch this new product, and a good chunk of it was spent online. I can't recall exact percentages, but it was over 50% of the budget. They certainly didn't agree with your idea that you voiced in this line:

"Neither you, or a SEO company will get you where you wanna be within a 1 week, month or even 6 months, so you mite as well keep [your money]".

So feel free to comment on your small-town, perfectly helpful area of "tinkering" with websites. But don't claim to know as much as a professional website developer or design agency, it just makes you look as small time and naive as I first thought.

Best of luck with your little business - it sounds like although you don't have any unique skills that you're able to package it in a way that clients like you. Maybe you have fab soft skills, or the ability to chat to them on a non-technical level - in which case I salute you!

relic

Discodave wrote: »

I really don't like you! lol - It's like you're saying i'm rubbish at my job (hobby)

I never once claimed to be a professional web developer, designer or anything of the sort (sorry if that how I made you think)

I am self taught in Dreamweaver/Photoshop and just enjoy designing websites as hobby for family or friends. I don't have a portfolio or will I have one, as the sites I have done are in need of a revamp. Besides, I am not looking to go professional.

www.gentlehands.co.uk was my first one (this is 1 that needs a looking at! - I'm sure you'll agree and pull it to bits!)

Sorry! I didn't mean to, I just wanted to point out that there is much more to be a web design rather than a few basics.

As for your website, it's simple and to the point, wouldn't expect much more for the prices you're charging.

Good luck with your efforts, and apologies for coming across so strongly!