Stolen phone bill - unusual situation

RD2003

Hello, my old mobile phone, last used by me two and a half years ago, was in my old car which was stolen at the start of the year. I was not on a monthly contract but paid for calls on Orange's Virgin price plan, which is no longer available. The last bill I received was in August 2007.

Today I received a bill for usage of the phone in April this year, amounting to £217.

I called Orange to tell them the phone had been stolen with the car, but because it was so long ago that I used the phone I didn't even think about me still owning it, let alone using it. I told them they could see that it had not been used for two and a half years, and yet they are telling me I must pay the bill.

Now, I never signed a contract with Orange, it was on a plan that they dont offer now, and I have not received any bills from them for two years. They are telling me that I have to pay the bill for whoever has reactivated the sim card and has been using it for the past month.

The police are going to investigate who has been using the phone, but I wondered if anyone else has had a similar experience to this. What if it was fifty years and someone started using it, would I still have to pay this bill, even if I am not on a contract with them? I am having trouble dealing with this so I would appreciate any advice you can give.

F_T_Buyer

If you're not in a contract, how can they charge you? You're either in a contract or on PAYG. Please explain...

Jon_01

The OVP plan was a old deal where there was no monthly line rental and you were only changed on the calls you made. You make no calls in a month, you get no bill. It's been a dead plan for years.

Any way, it is a contract, you don't need to have signed a contract. By using it you're tied in to the T&C's.
You are liable for all calls made on your acc up to the point you report the phone or sim lost or stolen, so, sorry it's a bill you're going have to pay.
You needed to have called them when your car was stolen, they would have blocked the sim and blacklisted the handset.

F_T_Buyer

Oh I see, I take back my previous post.

Wintermute

Jon_01 wrote: »

You are liable for all calls made on your acc up to the point you report the phone or sim lost or stolen, so, sorry it's a bill you're going have to pay.
You needed to have called them when your car was stolen, they would have blocked the sim and blacklisted the handset.

That's correct, if you never got the SIM blocked then you'll be liable for the calls. There's quite a lot of people with old pay up front phones sitting in drawers for emergency use only so it's not unheard of for phones to sit inactive for ages then suddenly get used.
If you did report the phone as stolen to the network and they didn't bar it or they somehow allowed somebody to activate a new SIM or remove the bars then you may have a case, but if you never reported it the best you can hope for is a goodwill gesture.

RD2003

I never signed a contract on which I pay monthly, as the previous poster said it was on the OVP plan. I do recall though that I was advised by Orange previously that if the OVP plan is not used for a period (I think it was two months) then it is cancelled and the charges revert to Orange's normal tariff.

Now, I never received anything to state that, nor did the traiff get changed as the bill I have received still charges me on the OVP plan.

When I called Orange they told me that I had not received any bills for two and a half years because they don't send out bills for zero pounds. However, they did send me one bill for zero pounds.

What I want to know is, if they took me to court for refusing to pay this bill, would I have a justifiable case to say how was I expected to remember that a phone I had not used for such a long time was a content of my stolen car? Had they sent me bills etc. I may have remembered this, but as far as I was concerned, because of the long period, and no use of the phone, my contract was cancelled.

Anyway, I appreciate your replies. I will await some information from the police to see whether they can identify who has been using the phone. I think if I can identify that they have been using it unlawfully, I should not have to pay Orange or I can take legal aid to sue them for the cost.

The other thing is that I am unemployed, disabled, and cannot work, hence why I did not use my car which had been declared off road. I simply can't afford to pay them at all.

cgk1

would I have a justifiable case to say how was I expected to remember that a phone I had not used for such a long time was a content of my stolen car?

Basically - No.

Wintermute

RD2003 wrote: »

if they took me to court for refusing to pay this bill, would I have a justifiable case to say how was I expected to remember that a phone I had not used for such a long time was a content of my stolen car?

They wont take you to court over it, that would cost them too much, if you don't pay it you're hurting yourself more than them, you'll get a default on your credit file and the debt will automatically be sold onto a debt collection agency who will chase you for the money owed.

Guys_Dad

I still have an active OVP sim that I use occasionally. I don't use it for months on end - maybe once every 18 months and I am glad I have it for emergencies and thank Orange for not cancelling it!

I, however, put a sim-lock on it - and every other sim I have used. It's there precisely for the sort of situation that OP has encountered and, if anyone doesn't use protection provided as well as not reporting a stolen unprotected sim, then we all know whose negligence is to blame.

Trying to weasel out on the grounds of "no written contract" cuts no ice with me, I am afraid.

This may sound unsympathetic and harsh, but taking basic steps to protect yourself before and after a theft is just common sense.

Jon_01

RD2003 wrote: »

Anyway, I appreciate your replies. I will await some information from the police to see whether they can identify who has been using the phone. I think if I can identify that they have been using it unlawfully, I should not have to pay Orange or I can take legal aid to sue them for the cost.

Unfortunately the person that stole the phone isn't under contract with Orange, you are.
You can certainly take legal action against the person whose used the phone but that's got nothing to do with Orange, they will still want paying.
If not (as stated above) they will put black marks on your credit file, pass the debt over to a collection company (who will add their charges to it) and they may send agent around to collect.
Better to call the Orange billing team and sort some kind of stage payments out before it comes to that.

forgotmyname

Until recently my wife had the same orange contract. You only paid for what you used which comes out of the bank
each month.

No calls = no bill, But you could use it as much as you want. I presume the phone/sim is just popped into a draw
and can be used at any time.

Have to find it out & destroy the sim or cancel the account.

I do not remember any 2 month limit and it would be disconnected. That would have been several
times a year for my wife. She rarely used it back then. But if she needed to use it there was no
worry about having enough credit.

I did warn her that anyone else using the phone could run up huge bills with no upper limit.

Thanks for the reminder.