Help! offered salary below nmw but want the job, best way to negotiate?

toberemembered

I have been offered a full time position by a company I worked for previously in a part time role. I left the job as it wasn't giving me enough hours but am happy to go back as full time. Its a pretty basic job working as a kitchen Porter in a fine dining restaurant with the opportunity to progress to commis chef.
Previously they were paying me £6.25ph in a 18 hour per week position. But now they have offered me £12500 for a 40 to 45 hours per week role, that works out as £6ph at best but for 45 hours which seems likely its only £5.34! I'm over 21 and that's under nmW for me.
I want and need the job but there's no way I will work for under nmw and I don't want to lose it by negotiating too hard. Does anyone have any advice for how to proceed? I know that the person who used to have this job was 19 so wasn't under. Nmw. I don't want to put them off hiring me but I'd been hoping for £14625 or £6.25ph or at least £13876 which is £5.93ph. Any advice would be really welcome!

brightonman123

work out what hours due towork x minimum wage is - £5.93 x 45 =?

PasturesNew

I bet they've quoted you to the 40 hours/week rate of £6/hour ... and they'd pay you overtime for the additional 5 hours if/when you did the extra.

They've probably not even realised you've dissected their offer in this way and come out with a below NMW figure. That's probably not what they meant/intended at all.

ferien_uk2011

I agree with Pastures New, it's probably best to speak to them first before you get yourself worried about it.

toberemembered

Thanks for the comments, you are probably right that its a misunderstanding. They are a pretty penny pinching company so any tips on negotiating a higher starting wage? They came to me with the job and haven't advertised it so I guess I'm in a fairly strong position. It seems a shame to go into a more responsible role at a lower rate of pay

Savvy_Sue

PasturesNew wrote: »

I bet they've quoted you to the 40 hours/week rate of £6/hour ... and they'd pay you overtime for the additional 5 hours if/when you did the extra.

They've probably not even realised you've dissected their offer in this way and come out with a below NMW figure. That's probably not what they meant/intended at all.

That's a very charitable assumption, PN. tbr, check, and get it in writing, that they WILL pay overtime and what the arrangements for getting overtime authorised are.

Otherwise, you may find that they have quoted a NMW salary for 40 hours a week, but they expect you to work 45 hours pw and they either DON'T anticipate paying overtime, or find some reason NOT to pay overtime, eg "if you were quicker you'd have been finished on time"; "Fred has signed your timesheet but didn't authorise the overtime" and so on.

Also that if you are regularly working 45 hours pw, or more, that there is a way of getting that recognised as your regular hours. Otherwise when you take a week's holiday it will be based on 40 hours. For ever.

As for getting the basic rate increased, I'm not sure how you'd do that: you could argue that you are experienced, known to them, so you will need minimal training so will "hit the ground running and pick up speed". You could certainly ask for the £6.25 per hour. And if it's not NMW even when divided by 40 hours pw, then DEFINITELY point that out to them!

But you might get the response of "if you don't want the job at that rate, plenty more will take it!"

toberemembered

I want to assume the best but from prior dealings with the manager I think he will try it on. Another aspect to this is that the company offers on-site accomodation for £2000 per year (£38.46 per week) and i am interested in moving in, the problem is if they only pay me nmw then the maximum they can charge is £32.27 per week (£1678 per year) or it brings my salary below what is considered to be nmw. Now I want to sort this out so that I dont go into the job feeling hard done by but appreciate that this is going to look pretty grabby when I present it to the manager, I'd effectively be asking for £14200 as a minimum.

I know that the head chef really wants me for this role so I'm wondering whether to use his influence to persuade the manager, or whether it's be better to keep him out of it and speak to the manager directly. The manager expressed concerns about paying me more than other salaried members of staff (full time waitress) in a conversation we had about the job previously but I fail to see how this is relevant as I am a: older so entitled to higher nmw and b: will not be discussing my salary with anyone at work.

I am planning to ask for a private meeting on tuesday to discuss the particulars of the job (I would be starting may 16th) where I will ask him how he arrived at £12500 and then give him my perspective and try to negotiate a higher starting salary based on a 45 hour per week commitment. Im also going to try to get the details of the job and acommodation package in writing, although the company dont offer a written contract.

Thanks to everyone who contributed so far, your advice is much appreciated!

Oldernotwiser

I wouldn't expect to get more than NMW for a KP job.

toberemembered

When they hired me before they honoured the agency rate of £6.25ph, I guess im probably expecting too much to be reinstated at that wage.

AimeesMum_2

toberemembered wrote: »

When they hired me before they honoured the agency rate of £6.25ph, I guess im probably expecting too much to be reinstated at that wage.

If you were agency staff before and were getting £6.25 then they would have been paying the agency at least £8 per hour for you so i don't think that you are expecting too much at all.

Just be confident when speaking and make sure that you write it all down before the meeting so that you know exactly what you mean.

Good luck and let us all know how you get on :p:p

Oldernotwiser

AimeesMum wrote: »

If you were agency staff before and were getting £6.25 then they would have been paying the agency at least £8 per hour for you so i don't think that you are expecting too much at all.

Just be confident when speaking and make sure that you write it all down before the meeting so that you know exactly what you mean.

Good luck and let us all know how you get on :p:p

You're forgetting all the extra costs (employers' NI for one) that an employer incurs when taking on a member of staff. That's why so many use agency staff, because it's so much cheaper than employing someone direct.