Advice Needed - Online Contract & Debt Collectors

Jonj1611

Hi,

I had an offer through the door of gym membership which at the time was a pretty good price.

So I signed up online, tick the "I accept" box and paid my joining fee and first months membership online by debit card.

Ok, so all good, had my induction date for the gym and was ready to go when I got a call from the gym saying the instructor was ill and I would have to do it another day, anyway to cut a long story short, this happened on all 3 of my "induction" dates in the first month, and you can't use the gym until the induction is done. Anyway, thought this is ridiculous, paid a months membership and hadnt even been because they cancelled every appointment I made.

So I thought, not going to bother with that gym anymore, so cancelled my DD.

Next thing I am getting a letter from some management company saying that I had signed up to a 30 month contract and that I had to pay over £400. I couldn't believe it, I hadn't even been! I explained that to them and the fact I did not see anything about a 30 month contract. At the time it was buried in the small print and when I clicked "I accept" that was what I was signing up to, it was not clear at all unless you read the small print(i know, i know) what I was signing up to. They have since changed their website where it is now clear as to what you are signing up to but like I said wasn't clear at the time.

For the last 6 months, I have had them sending me letters, calling me and getting some debt collectors involved. I have told them I am not paying anything as I never received any service from them and I had already lost my joining fee and first months membership fee.

Does anyone know where I stand on this? I am right to refuse to pay?

Regards
Jon

Jonj1611

Not even sure I am in the right section?

But anyway, any advice or thoughts welcome

Thanks
Jon

fluffnutter

Hi Jon. You have two main issues - the debt collection agency and your original problem with the gym. Firstly I'd write a letter to the debt collectors advising that the debt is denied and they must cease contacting you. Legally they should return the debt to the originating company and stop harassing you.

Your issue with the gym is more tricky. You have signed up to a 30 month contract and gym memberships are notoriously difficult to get out of. Not even death releases you from some contracts . Generally speaking you don't have any comeback purely because you've changed your mind. However, in this instance there is a clear reason why you've not been, and this is due to the gym cancelling your induction appointment - something that is beyond your control. This is the issue I'd concentrate on. Write to them (recorded delivery) explaining that, due to their actions, you've been unable to use the gym and that they must rectify this and refund you the premiums for the months you've not been able to use. Whether you can use this reason to get yourself out of the contract entirely I'm not sure, but you can certainly demonstrate that you've not been able to use the service yet, and for that reason, you shouldn't be charged.

If they set up the induction appointment and stuck to it, would you then be prepared to start using the gym? That's your best option, because I'm not sure you'll be able to cancel the entire 30 months. You could try letting them take you to court, I guess, but be prepared for months of debt collection hassle, plus a great big black mark on your credit file.

Jonj1611

Hi,

Many thanks for the reply, I will contact the debt collectors today with the advice you have given, as for the gym, I would prefer to get out of the contract if I could, but on the hand I really wanted to go as well. Its just left a bad taste in my mouth to be honest. If they reset up the induction appointment a credited me with the month I lost then I would be prepared to go, but there doesn't seem to be any talking with them, you say anything that doesnt involve paying the £400+ they want and they aren't interested, so think my only option is to get out of this contract if I can.

I have sent several letters to them recorded post and they aren't replying to any, just sending generic, you owe this and we want our money etc.

Again, thank you for the advice.

Regards
Jon

benrsmith31077

fluffnutter wrote: »

Hi Jon. You have two main issues - the debt collection agency and your original problem with the gym. Firstly I'd write a letter to the debt collectors advising that the debt is denied and they must cease contacting you. Legally they should return the debt to the originating company and stop harassing you.

Your issue with the gym is more tricky. You have signed up to a 30 month contract and gym memberships are notoriously difficult to get out of. Not even death releases you from some contracts . Generally speaking you don't have any comeback purely because you've changed your mind. However, in this instance there is a clear reason why you've not been, and this is due to the gym cancelling your induction appointment - something that is beyond your control. This is the issue I'd concentrate on. Write to them (recorded delivery) explaining that, due to their actions, you've been unable to use the gym and that they must rectify this and refund you the premiums for the months you've not been able to use. Whether you can use this reason to get yourself out of the contract entirely I'm not sure, but you can certainly demonstrate that you've not been able to use the service yet, and for that reason, you shouldn't be charged.

If they set up the induction appointment and stuck to it, would you then be prepared to start using the gym? That's your best option, because I'm not sure you'll be able to cancel the entire 30 months. You could try letting them take you to court, I guess, but be prepared for months of debt collection hassle, plus a great big black mark on your credit file.

Surely the OP could make the case that the Gym breached the contract by denying the use of facilities which are after all the whole point of the membership.

I am no expert on this but think that an online signed (I Accept Button) contract is shakey at best when it comes to enforcing it? Sure I heard that courts take a dim view of them generally.

Also as well as failing to provide the service OP paid for, could s/he not make case that the service is clearly sub standard, the 30 month term is not fair (guessing that was buried in small print?) and they have every right to cancel in the circumstances.
Also could they not get any black mark removed if debt was disputed and shown to be invalid?

At end of day, OP has not received what was paid for and there is every reason to believe that this level of incompetence will continue. (what kind of gym only has one instructor?)

Personally I would tell them to do one but as you say could involve hassle with DC's. Depends if OP really wants to use that gym and if they are up for a fight.

fluffnutter

benrsmith31077 wrote: »

.. could s/he not make case that the service is clearly sub standard, the 30 month term is not fair (guessing that was buried in small print?) and they have every right to cancel in the circumstances.
Also could they not get any black mark removed if debt was disputed and shown to be invalid?

The service is indeed substandard. But resolving that by arranging and sticking to the induction appointment might well be all that is legally required to sort that particular issue.

The 30 month term could be argued to be 'not fair', but this is a separate argument to the lack of a provided service. I personally think all long terms for gym memberships are nonsense. However, legally they might well have ticked every box. It's in the small print, even if 'buried'.

And yes, the mark on the credit file would have to be removed, if any ruling went in the OP's favour. Although getting the gym to do this might be less than straightforward.

I personally hope the OP manages to cancel the entire contract. I read so many bad things about gym membership on here I just think they're a bunch of shysters, frankly. However, legally speaking, I'm not sure how straightforward that would be.

Jonj1611

I had a long letter from them saying about my credit record, they seemed to highlight how bad it would be at every turn, its not perfect by a long shot, but still I will be trying to get it removed assuming I can get out of this contract, they are not interested in listening to anything I have to say on the phone and to be honest they are quite rude too.

As it happens the gym does have more than one instructor, but as I said, it seems to be only a couple that do inductions and either way on seperate occasions over a month each one was cancelled. They do have something in their own terms and conditions about being able to get out of the contract, but it requires them to fail on 2 points, hmm, one of them was failing to provide a service, but couldnt match up anything to the other one.

I have written to them today and will post it recorded tomorrow, and hopefully something will come out of it, but these people are relentless, its letter after letter and recently call after call.

Regards
Jon

fluffnutter

Jonj1611 wrote: »

They do have something in their own terms and conditions about being able to get out of the contract, but it requires them to fail on 2 points, hmm, one of them was failing to provide a service, but couldnt match up anything to the other one.

TBH, Jon, that 2 points thing probably wouldn't hold up in court. If you can't use the service at all, then that's only one point. But it's a pretty big one!

fluffnutter

Jonj1611 wrote: »

... but these people are relentless, its letter after letter and recently call after call.

Who's doing this? If it's the debt collectors then they should stop if you 'deny the debt'. If it's the gym, it's not so easy to get them to stop. But there is a 'reasonable' amount that someone can call you. Make a note of the number of calls and letters. Recently a bank was bollocked by a court for pursuing someone too enthusiastically. It was deemed harassment, even though the money was owed.

Jonj1611

Its Ashbourne Management and ARC debt collectors. Seem to be well known on here after a recent search.

Regards
Jon

fluffnutter

Jonj1611 wrote: »

Its Ashbourne Management and ARC debt collectors. Seem to be well known on here after a recent search.

Regards
Jon

Tell the debt collectors to do one. Tell Ashbourne Management that you're happy to communicate in writing (and have been doing so). Tell them if they continue to call, you'll complain to the filth, sorry, rozzers, sorry police.

Seriously, can you block their number? There's no need for them to call at all. You're not avoiding them; you're dealing with them in writing so that you have a record of communication. If they continue to call, I'd mention harassment, police, etc.