Vaccine related lumps on neck of two cats?

h.cowell

Hi, we have two cats, both 17-weeks old. Ten days ago they had their vaccine boosters - no ill effects, but we did notice that one of them quickly developed a raised lump on the back of her neck at the vaccination site. A couple of days later, the second cat had a noticable lump too.

We took them back to the vet on Friday (8 days after the booster) who checked them out, and told us there was no obvious infection and that the lumps should subside on there own.

But I had one of the cat's on my lap earlier and I'm sure the lump is getting bigger... and more lop-sided. I know there are rare side effects with the booster jab (don't even want to think about it!) but wondered if anyone else has experienced this, and assuming the lumps are nothing to worry about, how long should they take to go down?

Kitties are behaving normally - very active, and eating well

juliebunny

I haven't experienced this but have heard of it. Insist that your vet documents this case back to the drug company.

if you google this, you will see there is loads of discussion about this and the drug companies will deny any link -that's why they need the evidence shoved in their face!

h.cowell

Thanks juliebunny... if the lumps are still there later this week, we'll be taking them to the vets again. I'm trying to avoid checking too often - I don't want to make them sore, or start imagining things! I've had a look round on Google and am amazed at the number of pet owners reporting this, and there are reports of it takng weeks for the lumps to go. I'm not sure I'll be happy to vaccinate next year, since both cats have reacted to it this time around. Some people on the web are discussing 3-yearly vaccinations instead, with titers done inbetween? I'll ask the vet

badmumof1

mine had a lump come up and it soon went down.
Had mine done in November and all is fine

juliebunny

h.cowell wrote: »

Thanks juliebunny... if the lumps are still there later this week, we'll be taking them to the vets again. I'm trying to avoid checking too often - I don't want to make them sore, or start imagining things! I've had a look round on Google and am amazed at the number of pet owners reporting this, and there are reports of it takng weeks for the lumps to go. I'm not sure I'll be happy to vaccinate next year, since both cats have reacted to it this time around. Some people on the web are discussing 3-yearly vaccinations instead, with titers done inbetween? I'll ask the vet

Your vet will tell you whatever the drug company tell them usually.....I've read articles recommending vaccination every 18 months but most vets will insist you then give a double course again because the previous one has 'run out' being over a year ago - so you can't really win. And of course if you need to put them in a cattery, they will insist on annual vaccinations.

Having seen the effects of various feline illnesses, such as cat flu and calici virus, I still vaccinate my cats - I have the flu vacc myself each year, in fairness to them too!!

loulou123

My cat gets this every time she has a booster injection. Lump tends to stay for a week or two and then disapear.

Did mention it to vets 1st time this happened and he said it was possible she was showing a very mild reaction to the jab (a bit like some people, me included do to the flu jabs etc.)

Personally i'd rather 'risk' this small lump for a week a year - which doesnt bother her in the slightest, then take the risk of feline leukimia or FIV etc.

Willow5

I breed siamese cats, the first litter my cat had, had no problems after their injections, the second litter of 6 kittens (breed with the same mother and father) all had reactions to their injections. Our vet said he had never seen every member of a litter react to the vacination before (all were injected with the same batch number). It was reported to the manufacturers, who said they had, had no other problems with the batch used by my vet (they would, but to be fair, the previous litter were injected with the same make of vaccine, and as previously stated, had no reaction).
The vet saw us several times (and did not charge) he assured me that though not common, this was a known reaction (he was very good, speaking to the owner of the one kitten I had sold before the lump on her kitten appeared, and her vet). He said the lump that each kitten had would go, without any treatment, but could take up to 6 months. In our case all the lumps (only one, of varying sizes, on each cat) went after about 2 months. None of the kittens (2 of which I kept), have had any reaction to any further vaccinations

snowman2_2

If you didn't get any reaction to a vaccine, it wouldn't work. The whole point of a vaccination (or the homeopathic equivalent) is to get a response from the immune system. This varies between individuals, between litter mates, between vaccine brands and even batches. If you get a reaction you are worried about, see your vet but the risk of a serious adverse reaction is very low. The risk of a serious or fatal disease in an unvaccinated pet is much higher.

Sooz00

Lumps and vaccination is a bit of a hot topic of mine at the moment.

h.cowell wrote: »

...We took them back to the vet on Friday (8 days after the booster) who checked them out, and told us there was no obvious infection and that the lumps should subside on there own.
But I had one of the cat's on my lap earlier and I'm sure the lump is getting bigger... and more lop-sided. I know there are rare side effects with the booster jab (don't even want to think about it!) but wondered if anyone else has experienced this, and assuming the lumps are nothing to worry about, how long should they take to go down? ...

Vaccinations (and other injections) can cause inflammation at the injection site. Some excellent advice from Professor David Argyle (referring specifically to rabies and feline leukaemia vaccinations but good advice for any) is: 'Some Rabies and FeLV vaccinations will produce post-vaccination lumps in nearly 100% of cats vaccinated. Most of these will resolve over a 2-3 month period, and most vaccine-associated sarcomas will not occur prior to 3 months following vaccination. Consequently it is recommended that all post-vaccination lumps be removed if still present at 3 months (or if they grow beyond 2 cm, before 3 months). Surgical biopsy is recommended prior to definitive removal.'

h.cowell wrote: »

Thanks juliebunny... if the lumps are still there later this week, we'll be taking them to the vets again. I'm trying to avoid checking too often - I don't want to make them sore, or start imagining things! I've had a look round on Google and am amazed at the number of pet owners reporting this, and there are reports of it takng weeks for the lumps to go. I'm not sure I'll be happy to vaccinate next year, since both cats have reacted to it this time around. Some people on the web are discussing 3-yearly vaccinations instead, with titers done inbetween? I'll ask the vet

Any adverse reaction should be reported the the VMD (Veterinary Medicines Directorate). Ask your vet to do this but also do it yourself. The link is below. That way your kitties reactions are noted and it also helps the VMD and manufacturers.
http://www.vmd.gov.uk/public/adverse.aspx
http://www.vmd.gov.uk/adversereactionreporting/Product.aspx?SARType=Animal

juliebunny wrote: »

Your vet will tell you whatever the drug company tell them usually.....I've read articles recommending vaccination every 18 months but most vets will insist you then give a double course again because the previous one has 'run out' being over a year ago - so you can't really win. And of course if you need to put them in a cattery, they will insist on annual vaccinations.
Having seen the effects of various feline illnesses, such as cat flu and calici virus, I still vaccinate my cats - I have the flu vacc myself each year, in fairness to them too!!

It should really depend on the type of vaccine. DNA recombinant vaccines still need to be given every year but some of the adjuvanted vaccines are now every 3 years. Your vet should be able to confirm or you can ask which your cat has and look up the product yourself.

snowman2 wrote: »

If you didn't get any reaction to a vaccine, it wouldn't work. The whole point of a vaccination (or the homeopathic equivalent) is to get a response from the immune system. This varies between individuals, between litter mates, between vaccine brands and even batches. If you get a reaction you are worried about, see your vet but the risk of a serious adverse reaction is very low. The risk of a serious or fatal disease in an unvaccinated pet is much higher.

I agree with Snowman 2 regarding the vaccination causing inflammation which stimulates a response from the immune system. Also the risk of a serious reaction is low here in the UK where certain vaccines are not a legal requirement as they are in some states in the US.

However, I disagree that ‘the risk of a serious or fatal disease in an unvaccinated pet is much higher.’ This is generalization. As per both the BSAVA and WSAVA guidelines, every vet should be carrying out a full risk assessment to each an every pet on an individual basis. The BSAVA support the concept ‘that a thorough risk /benefit assessment on an individual case basis should be discussed with clients when deciding on timing of vaccination and use of particular vaccines for particular animals.’

The WSAVA go further and state ‘At the time of vaccine administration, the following information should be recorded in the patient’s permanent medical record: date of vaccine administration, identity (name, initials, or code) of the person administering the vaccine, vaccine name, lot or serial number, expiry date, manufacturer, site and route of vaccine administration.’

The WSAVA also states ‘Adverse events should be recorded in a manner that will alert all staff members during future visits. Informed consent should be documented in the medical record in order to demonstrate that relevant information was provided to the client and that the client authorised the procedure. At the very least, this notation should indicate that a discussion of risks and benefits took place prior to vaccination.’

Too many vets (including my EX vet) don’t assess risks and benefits. My cats are FeLV negative housecats. I was too naïve when I started dealings with that vet and believed her when I was told they should have FeLV vaccines. She did not assess risk and tell me that as housecats, the risk of them contracting feline leukaemia was negligible (only if they got out and had incredibly close contact (sharing blood/saliva) with an infected cat.

Sadly, my boy is one of the unlucky cats that did/does have one of the rare side effects Snowman 2 mentions – vaccine associated fibrosarcoma (VAS). I am lucky he is insured and has had access to some of the UK’s (and Europe’s) best surgeons and oncologists. He is 6 years on from his original diagnosis. He had chemo, major surgery and more chemo and had 4.5 years of remission before I found a recurrence. He then had surgery to remove the recurrence. He had another recurrence confirmed in January and just had extensive surgery including removing part of one shoulder blade, spinous processes and the tip of the other. He is due to start chemo this week. Money saving goes out of the window with this boy – over £15k at the last count (of which £11ish was covered by insurance).

Now I’m not against vaccinating at all, but the professionals really should be following individual risk assessment guidelines and also be avoiding vaccinating in the intrascapular space (scruff) as it’s so hard for surgeons to achieve good margins should a serious side effect such as VAS occur. In the USA, vaccines are now mainly given as low down on the leg as possible in order that an amputation can cure the cat of cancer. Owners should also be made aware of all risks, regardless of how rare they may be. VAS was first discovered 20 years ago back in 1991, so there is no reason for professionals not to know about as part of their CPD.

Anyway back to H.Cowell – please don’t let my post panic you, I didn’t mean to, it’s just a topic close to my heart because of everything my boy has been through and is still going through. Your kitties lumps have come up really soon after your vaccines so they are more than likely to resolve themselves and not be anything serious. Nevertheless, get the reactions reported to the VMD (when they send it through to the manufacturer, the manufacturer may contact you or your vet about paying for immunity tests next year if they are available – they are doing this with my dog who was vomiting for 36 hours after his annual vaccs last year). Keep a record of the lumps though just in case. Location, size, shape, whether attached or mobile, if attached – what to etc. It will help you and your vet know whether they change/grow/get smaller etc. I do think the likelihood is that they will resolve themselves so please try not to panic. Give them a gentle stroke for us x

tankgirl1

As has been said, vaccines need to provoke a reaction in order to work.

I don't know the full in's and out's, despite being a qualified vet nurse.

I have though seen cats (and dogs) die from diseases which can be vaccinated against.

I think my vet nursing tutor taught me well - she said no vaccine is without risk, and as such I always insist that my cats vaccines get administered over the lower part of the shoulder - just in case. Therefore the whole limb could be removed, which cats cope very well with.

No offence meant Sooz00, but that is very extensive and painful surgery for your kitty cat......

Sooz00

tankgirl1 wrote: »

I don't know the full in's and out's, despite being a qualified vet nurse.

It is a topic I (understandably) feel strongly about. And as I said, I’m not against vaccinations and my dogs and other dogs in my care (I foster for a couple of rescues) are all vaccinated following a good assessment by my current, very diligent, vet. However, VAS in particular has been known about for 20 years. I don’t understand why individual full risk/benefit assessments are not routinely carried out as per BSAVA and WSAVA guidelines but I applaud any vet/practice who does. Also, as vaccination plays such a huge role in practices, I don’t understand how vets and staff are not aware of and informing of the possible side effects, regardless of how rare. In December 09, over 15 months ago, the AVMA saw fit to revise their general vaccination flyer to include this but it seems not to have filtered through to the UK yet. Please see below.

https://ebusiness.avma.org/EBusiness50/files/productdownloads/vaccination_brochure.pdf

Maybe the VMD will insist on something added to the product spec or data sheets soon, according to an email I received from them last month, they are in the process of concluding some research so we'll wait to see what that brings.

tankgirl1 wrote: »

I have though seen cats (and dogs) die from diseases which can be vaccinated against.

I think vet nurses do a great job and have no doubt that the above is a very distressing part of your role and sadly too common; but a one shot fits all approach is not the answer. My cats for example, simply were not at risk and did not need the FeLV vaccine. If they were young, outdoor, un-neutered, perhaps it would be a different story but they aren’t. They weren’t at risk and did not need that vaccine.

tankgirl1 wrote: »

I think my vet nursing tutor taught me well - she said no vaccine is without risk, and as such I always insist that my cats vaccines get administered over the lower part of the shoulder - just in case. Therefore the whole limb could be removed, which cats cope very well with.

I’m pleased that you are using the alternative location that the AAFP and VAFSTF recommended many years ago – you are right, you are maximizing your cat’s survival chances should such a serious side effect happen. Hopefully this is the general approach at your practice and one that more and more practices will use. Tripod cats do incredibly well - I have a front leg amputee amongst my guys and he’s amazing!

tankgirl1 wrote: »

No offence meant Sooz00, but that is very extensive and painful surgery for your kitty cat......

A little offence taken but it’s not something I didn’t hear from colleagues years ago when he was first diagnosed. My boy is a fighter and as long as he is, I will fight for him. If you knew him, I have no doubt you would understand. I owe it to him to fight as long as he does, I should not have trusted that vet so implicitly and I wont make the same mistake again.

I did not take the decision lightly. He saw my GP vet, his oncology specialist and his European and RCVS recognized specialist soft tissue surgeon. I sought a second opinion with a very renowned pioneering surgeon. I also spoke with a number of other VAS cat owners in the US. All were in agreement.

He had his op on the Monday, was up and about SO quickly it scared me. There is no way a human would be after such surgery. My boy is inspiring. He was off pain relief after 3 days and home (earlier than scheduled) on the Friday. I had him on cage rest at home for 3 weeks or so, emptying his drain every 3-4 hours, day and night. He was then on room rest whilst everything settled and he is now back to his normal routine. We are almost 2 months on now and he has his bloods and urine tests this afternoon prior to him starting anti-angiogenic chemo. He is such a happy, cuddly, cheeky cat and his movement is 100% . Both the margins and shaved margins were clean. I have no doubt that I did the right thing.

H.Cowell – sorry to hijack again. I really do wish the best for your kitties and I do think the likelihood of their lumps being anything serious are minimal. I wish you all of you, all the best x